let's talk about synths and other musician-ish things

kensuguro · Post by **kensuguro** » Wed Aug 16, 2006 6:47 pm

this is a musician's forum afterall. Let's bring it back to the roots, the origin of the flow, the heart of every pulsarian: synths and music!

What do you think your weakest spot is in terms of your synth/vsti/sampler combo? For me, it's pads. I don't know why, but look back to my older posts and you'll see that I'm consistantly a not-so-pad guy. I just vaguely understand the theyr'e suposed to be surreal and ever changing and what not, but for some reason, I don't "feel" it in me, whether this pad is better than the other one.

I'm thinking of remedying this with some sort of additive vsti like camelaudio cameleon some day.. I can build all sorts of synths, but a pad machine. lol

Aside from being sonically pad challenged, I'm sort of pad challenged in a theory/structure point of view too. I mean, the only way I can think of using a pad is to basically, "pad" the chords. With a little stretch of imagination, I guess I can visualize (auralize?) a pad being used with less focus on harmony (less notes) but more emphasis on texture evolution.. but that's much too atmospheric, and my guess is that it'll end up like the gazillion other "threw a drumloop over some pads" lounge music. Well, I guess they have something I don't, PADS! So I shouldn't be saying bad things about them.

So, with a slight shift of vector from war vibe to the good ol' planetZ vibes, what's your synth story?

[ This Message was edited by: kensuguro on 2006-08-16 19:49 ]

Post by **hubird** » Wed Aug 16, 2006 7:59 pm

we also could discuss the weather, isn't it?

Post by **Neil B** » Wed Aug 16, 2006 11:43 pm

Aw c'mon Huub - asking the British to discuss the weather?
How much spare time have you got

Counterparts · Post by **Counterparts** » Thu Aug 17, 2006 12:59 am

On 2006-08-16 20:59, hubird wrote:
we also could discuss the weather, isn't it?

It's right miserable today!

My biggest problem with synths is probably...just that there's too damn many of them and each of them have too many damn sounds. Where to start? That's why I found the Luxonix ROMpler VSTi (Ravity S) to be such a breath of fresh air.

For example, if I want a "string-like sound" I can just select one in Ravity, I don't have to spend hours trying to dial-in the sound I'm looking for (and I'm just not that good a synth programmer to be able to do this quickly and easily).

If somebody were to bring out a "JV-1080 VSTi" or similar, I'd buy it in a second. Best synth I've ever owned methinks.

In other news: lousy weather we're having!

emzee · Post by **emzee** » Thu Aug 17, 2006 5:21 am

Ken

I've been absent for a while..... but I gotta ask you this. How do you get such awesome sound? I remember you changed the way you were working some time back. I listened to a bit of your work and thought Man.... what awesome clarity and punch.

Could ya... would ya... share a few tips. Is it your hardware.... your software...????

Edit: I'd better change my signature. I haven't been reading the vitriol but I never meant to add to it!
_________________
I'd love to see things from your perspective.....but I can't get my head in that position.

[ This Message was edited by: emzee on 2006-08-17 06:22 ]

Spirit · Post by **Spirit** » Thu Aug 17, 2006 6:07 am

I fnd I'm getting more & more tired of synths and tending towards really high quality sample sets.

But what I really dislike is doof doof drums. Just today I went to the big annual show in my city and no matter what the event everyone used doof doof backing music. Then there's doof doof neighbours where the sub bass travels through all the foundations and supporting structures, and doof doof car music systems...

I'm reacting so strongly to it all that the music I write now very rarely has any drums at all !

DigiSUN · Post by **DigiSUN** » Thu Aug 17, 2006 6:40 am

Spirit: What's doof doof? Do you mean oomtsa oomtsa?

[ This Message was edited by: DigiSUN on 2006-08-17 07:59 ]

kensuguro · Post by **kensuguro** » Thu Aug 17, 2006 7:10 am

ha, that's what I'm talkin' about guys. Musicians talking about musician things.
Counterparts, the synth look pretty cool. I'm sampletank user so I alreadly like the "rompler as a vsti" concept. I'm going to look into the Luxonix one. Sometimes I get sick of spending so much time just preparing to write the music.

Emzee: lol. Well, if you like my sound in particular, thanks. I've spent years achieving the workflow. Can't say it's been perfected, esp the lower deeper bass. The main thing I do alot is overdrive. I was looking for a way to do overdrive without "breaking" the sound.

The trick was to use a para EQ before the overdrive to weaken the bass just a bit, and to also shape the sound a bit, and then to do an overdrive on it. Usually an overdrive setting of 2db, with a -0.3db gain works without breaking the sound too much. You'd be surprised out how much you can get away with, and how much clarity (high end) it puts on your synth or rompler sounds. Works like an exciter, but more drastically.

But the drawback is that all this power in the high end comes at the price of low end punch. That's what I have to work on. Right now, my balance is to focus the bass at a slightly higher area, around 150hz. It's a bit boxy, or "roomy", which can be good or bad depending on the type of music.

Spirit · Post by **Spirit** » Thu Aug 17, 2006 8:04 am

On 2006-08-17 07:40, DigiSUN wrote:
Spirit: What's doof doof? Do you mean oomtsa oomtsa?

[ This Message was edited by: DigiSUN on 2006-08-17 07:59 ]

The standard 4-4 bass drum mixed ridiculously high:

song starts:

doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof

snare drum roll: tappa tappa tappa tappa tappa tappa

doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof doof-doof-doof-doof

song ends

astroman · Post by **astroman** » Thu Aug 17, 2006 8:52 am

it could become a big seller in Germany...
'doof' is the slang expression for stupid, so you should include that as a vocal sample

cheers, Tom

darkrezin · Post by **darkrezin** » Thu Aug 17, 2006 9:45 am

Ken - maybe use a crossover of some kind to separate out the frequencies, then overdrive only the freqs above the crossover frequency.

Then mix them back together afterwards.

Kinda obvious I know, but maybe you didn't try it yet.

Spirit · Post by **Spirit** » Thu Aug 17, 2006 10:28 am

On 2006-08-17 09:52, astroman wrote:
it could become a big seller in Germany...
'doof' is the slang expression for stupid, so you should include that as a vocal sample

cheers, Tom

Hmmm... well "Da, Da, Da" worked, so "Doof Doof Doof" seems fair too

alfonso · Post by **alfonso** » Thu Aug 17, 2006 3:35 pm

On 2006-08-17 10:45, darkrezin wrote:
Ken - maybe use a crossover of some kind to separate out the frequencies, then overdrive only the freqs above the crossover frequency.

Then mix them back together afterwards.

Kinda obvious I know, but maybe you didn't try it yet.

I had in mind that problem when I made this one:

http://www.planetz.com/forums/viewtopic ... orum=16&17

emzee · Post by **emzee** » Thu Aug 17, 2006 4:20 pm

Aaaah.... makes sense. Thanks for your generosity in sharing that. I appreciate it.

braincell · Post by **braincell** » Thu Aug 17, 2006 5:09 pm

I sort of drifted away from the electronic dance sound. I agree the high quality sample sets are great. It's fun to make your own samples by mic or by warping them with tons of effects. You tend to lose the presence with effects so those are good for background sounds.

paulrmartin · Post by **paulrmartin** » Thu Aug 17, 2006 6:00 pm

I agree with Ken that pad sounds are the hardest to achieve nowadays because of these screaming oscillators that put out too many harmonics. I like Vectron a lot but never seems to get it to quiet down unless I put a filter on it and Horus the Chorus in its path. And even then it doesn't give me the results I want.

There is nothing like a subtractive synth to get great results as far as pads are concerned. Well, to my ears anyways...

kensuguro · Post by **kensuguro** » Fri Aug 18, 2006 2:13 am

Ken - maybe use a crossover of some kind to separate out the frequencies, then overdrive only the freqs above the crossover frequency.

Then mix them back together afterwards.

Kinda obvious I know, but maybe you didn't try it yet.

heh, strangely enough, I haven't tried that yet. lol That would definiltey be a good way to save the lower end.

Shroomz~> · Post by **Shroomz~>** » Fri Aug 18, 2006 2:25 am

Our Juno-60 makes some lush pads, but it's a tank to have around, especially if you move house a lot.

Hysteric · Post by **Hysteric** » Fri Aug 18, 2006 2:58 am

Gutsy machine though.

Shroomz~> · Post by **Shroomz~>** » Fri Aug 18, 2006 3:07 am

It sure is & the chorus on it is incredible sounding.