Mystery solved: NEW PC CONFIGURATION!

AndreD · Post by **AndreD** » Sun Sep 02, 2007 2:53 pm

by the way,
it´s NOT the trick, to use as most fans as possible

you will just need _one_ chasse fan on the back of your case that exhausts the air by suction . (together with the PSU fan)
just make shure that there is a _small_ air supply (without a fan!) on the front of the pc case.
you have to seal _all_ other air supplies as good as possible.!

now, you will induce a depression insite the case that cools _much_ better (and more quiet) than a lot of fans which are extraction by suction and blowing at the same time.
(that would just generate some air-twirls but not an effektive cooling)

juat imagine that you are trying to induce a vaccum isnide of your pc-case

(front=small air supply / sealing/ back=psu and chasse fan)
that is the right way

Nestor · Post by **Nestor** » Sun Sep 02, 2007 6:58 pm

Thank Andre you for the tip!

In fact, I use a Thremaltake Xaser II case and it comes with 5 fans already, and I have to say that it is a no nonsense the way it works. The case is already built in the way you’re explaining. There are two fans that get air into the case coming from the front side, and then there are other two that take the air out, at the back. The 5th fan is on the side door itself, and it comes very handy to cool the south bridge.

AndreD · Post by **AndreD** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 12:28 am

Nestor wrote:Thank Andre you for the tip!

In fact, I use a Thremaltake Xaser II case and it comes with 5 fans already, and I have to say that it is a no nonsense the way it works. The case is already built in the way you’re explaining. There are two fans that get air into the case coming from the front side, and then there are other two that take the air out, at the back. The 5th fan is on the side door itself, and it comes very handy to cool the south bridge.

And thats exactly the wrong way

(You wont have a proper negative pressure because you are using blowing and sucking fans in the same system!)

negative pressure is the clou when it comes to proper system cooling.
(but there might be cooling enough causesd by air twrisl to keep your system running in your current setup )

but again, air twirls are not as effective as negative pressure!

noise magic components are just great for building silent pcs

http://www.noisemagic.de/info/nmt-2/info.htm
http://noisemagic.de/engl/start.htm

Post by **hubird** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 5:02 am

if the 5 fan 'system' is integrated well, could it then be that it's tuned to always keep underpressure?

Nestor · Post by **Nestor** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 11:21 am

I don't get what you mean by "underpreasure", what do you mean? Cheers

Post by **hubird** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 1:01 pm

Nestor wrote:I don't get what you mean by "underpreasure", what do you mean? Cheers

underpressure...below 1 atmosphere (1= no pressure), your car's tires are supposed to have (over)pressure f.i.

Andre says, underpressure makes (cool) air going into the case.
During temperature changes the fans should keep underpressure all the time

Nestor · Post by **Nestor** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 6:34 pm

Ok, I understand now, thanks for explaining Hubird

As I have been working with an open case for a few hours, when I checked the CPU temperature it was at 43 ºC, but when I closed the door and applied the 5th fan, it was amazing, the CPU came down to 21 Cº. I guess that the Thermaltake Xaser II does implement this underpressure you’re talking about, otherwise how can it work so well. Cheers

Post by **garyb** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 9:13 pm

it's an engineered case and a special circumstance...

generally, AndreD is correct...

so, they exchanged the cooler?

Nestor · Post by **Nestor** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 7:19 am

He he... I'm reserving it to tell the whole story...

It has become a Sope Opera already...

Get ready for next chapter, same day and channel:

The Fan was pure Fun!

kylie · Post by **kylie** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 7:24 am

Nestor wrote: It has become a Sope Opera already...

you didn't mean Scope Opera, by any chance?

(or even Soap Opera

)

kaju · Post by **kaju** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 8:43 am

What Andre says about the underpressure or vacuum is most interesting. I'm starting to build a new pc around DP965LT and E6600 and possibly Antec Titan650 (I'm waiting for all the parts to arrive).
So if this 'lesser fans better cooling' really works I don't think I have to buy any more extra fans than there already is in the large Antec server case.

But the Soap Opera. When do we have the opening night?

kaju · Post by **kaju** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 10:13 am

next to nothing · Post by **next to nothing** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 12:43 pm

a few points;

- Most "modern" PSU's (as the one Nestor just aquired) have an airflow from bottom thru the psu and out the back. this essentially works as an exhaust fan.

- as to the "fan in front" versus "negative pressure": negative pressure is, ofcourse, better in theory. a few points to be considered is as follows:

- strong exhaust out the back ad NO AIR in front will force airflow into the case from all available cracks in your case. they are often designed to let air flow in from the bottom of the case, which (again, theoretically

) will bring a lot of dust from the places you seldom vacuum (read: beneath your case), which again isnt good for your cooling system (dust will be transferred to your gfx and cpu fan).

- equal airflow from front to back will often result in air following a "path" thru your cabinet, often leaving areas (typically above your harddrives an high up in the case in general) unventilated. not good.

one could argue back and fourth of what is better etc. (as with cooling paste

) but my general advice would be to supply air in the front and out the back. a typical ratio would be 3 exhaust, 2 supply, one of the supply fans blow over your harddrives.

myself; well my gaming/video PC has one front, one back plus psu fan, my music pc have psu plus 2 in the back, one in the front. the music pc has also been fitted with approx 30 kg of sound proofing material (yeah its crazy but i had too little to worry about for a period of time). none of them ever complained.

so; mre out the back but some in the front if u ask me.

next to nothing · Post by **next to nothing** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 12:46 pm

oh and the soundproofing bit is just mentioned as it insulates the whole fuckin cabinet, meaning approxiatly no heat leaving thru the metal.

kaju · Post by **kaju** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 1:44 pm

Interesting reply, piddi.
You answered some of the questions I had in my mind. I really don't believe it is possible to create a "working" vacuum in an average computer case. "Underpressure" maybe.
Your advice however sounds sensible and might be a good compromise.

Nestor · Post by **Nestor** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 7:16 pm

Hello there people!

Here we go with the next chapter of the “Scope Opera

”: “The Fan was Pure Fun”

Well, what happened is that I have never seen a dual core running before I’ve got mine, so I would have never suspected that the “main fan” could get just quiet or stop moving! For me that was a terribly omen that would suggest sudden death of the CPU by overheating! I know that AMD Athons CPUs were suspected to die from 10 to 12 seconds after not having an active fan. I still was in those days… I didn’t know things had changed in such a radical way in terms of temperature.

To stare at a CPU fan without rushing to switch off the system, is an impossible thought for somebody used to work with Pentium 4s and old Athlon CPUs!

Well, an incredible coincidence made me believe firmly in a bad fan. The coincidence was that a cable touched the fan, and it immediately after stopped. Then I cleared the cables and started the system twice again, and the fan would not move.

I guess I’m not the only person that has worried much about seen this… I can imagine many guys like myself, switching off their system at light speed.
Ok guys, I am right now writing from a new computer… He!

My first computer was called “Little Pitter”, the second one raised its status and came to be “Zeus” and the last one was baptized “Fenix” by my lovely wife, because – she said – it has been reborn for its own ashes… Yea, she’s also crazy like me!

So far so good, the system is running extremely stable but I am just starting installation, so, it’s too early to swear about it. Right now, I’m doing an XP online update.

You know? I still get slightly anxious when I see that the CPU fan stops in my eyes… it’s so strange. Now, CPU temperature is a mere 21 ºC, which is very low.

About Gigabyte:
Shame on Gigabyte installation DVD! The bloody Google Bar is constantly ticking itself so you install it. You say “no, thank you”, but the box ticks itself again and again and again, this is not fair… It is a stupid behavior for such a big company to try forcing people. What are they doing? It is silly when a rich man gets covetous for a penny! Common you guys at Gigabyte, we are not children, we like to choose by ourselves what is to be installed and way. Do you really need to increase your incomes being one of the biggest MOBO sellers in the world? This plays completely against your corporative image

The Enermax FMAII 535 is so silent that you need to get your ear at a few centimeters to hear its fans. There are two of them, one smaller and the second one pretty big. Very efficient by the way, as the unit keeps quite cool; there is a knob for you to increase or decrease the fans speed, but as you can hardly hear anything, well, it doesn’t matter how fast they turn, so I have chosen to let them full speed. The cables that come with the PSU are of excellent quality and grasp hard to every take, nothing to worry about a loose cable or connection at all.

My configuration is as follows:
Case: Thermaltake Xaser II
PSU: Enermax FMA II 535 watts
MOBO: GIGABYTE P35C-DS3R
CPU: Intel Core 2 Duo E6750 - 2.66 GHZ 1333 MHZ 4MB
RAM: DDR2 Corsair Twin X 2GB (2X1024) 6400C4 800MHZ
VIDEO CARD: EVGA 8600 GTS 256MB
1394: Advantec card with three plugs
HDD: 3 SATA, 160GB, 250GB, 400GB
DVD RW: LG
CD reader: Asus 52X
Floppy: 1.44
SCOPE: one Pulsar 1 Plus Card made in 1998 (still for me, the most advanced piece of hardware for what I can do with it)

Cheers

Note: I will keep you informed on how it performs, in a few days, when all the installations have been done, I don’t have all the time I need for that right now.

Happy "Scope Opera"...

Post by **garyb** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 9:37 pm

haha, fakeout!

i'd never seen that(or noticed it)....

Nestor · Post by **Nestor** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 11:12 pm

You have to be kidding... aren't you?

I don't belive you, unless you are in a very hot room building systems...

Nestor · Post by **Nestor** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 11:25 pm

BTW: The Xpress Recovery2 software to backup your "C" drive that comes with the board works very well. The only problem I can see is that it is very slow compared with other recovery products in the market. But hey, it comes as an addition to the pack. I did a try now that I am starting with the installation, and it worked perfectly well.
Anyway, be warned you Gigabyte users, that the app does not work with “every” Gigabyte board. The problem is that most people have an IDE drive for their “C” drive, this is not a problem, but those like me that uses only SATA drives may have board compatibility problems. SATA drives are supported for most recent boards only. You must check in the Gigabyte site if your board is supported to use SATA drives, before getting into the trouble of using it. Otherwise, it works as advertised, slow, but great!
Pulsar is ALONE in IRQ Nº 20. I have assigned the PCI 3 for its exclusive use. There are 3 PCI in the board, but only one can be completely isolated, and this is the third one, which in fact, is the one messing with the SATA connections… when I first noticed it, I thought it would be a problem… but I was wrong. The space is small, but when you actually install a card there, you realize how smart the layout of the board is. No problems with Pulsar, no problems with SATA, they are civilized citizens of the board, no racism between them, fortunately!
Now… I can see that when the system starts, the screen announces me that RAM is been used as “single channel” and not DDR. I have not a clue yet of why, let see…
See you, Cheers.

Post by **garyb** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 11:43 pm

Nestor wrote:You have to be kidding... aren't you? I don't belive you, unless you are in a very hot room building systems...

nah, i just never noticed it. temperatures have never gone out of normal range and as i said, those cpus will shut down long before they overheat, so....plus, i guess i just expect them to work these days....

if i'd heard a bad noise(i use lots of carefully placed zip ties

), then i might have checked like you did. i also would have made sure that that behavior(no fan at first) was normal, but i might have interpretted the symptoms differently, because i have noticed the fans throttling down on startup....