4(+) cards...?

[unaHm]

Dear all,

I've recently come into ownership of a motherboard with 6 PCI slots (ASUS P4PE), which is great!

The cards I currently have are:

1x Luna (3DSP)
1x Pulsar (4DSP)
2x Pulsar SRB (4DSP)

I have a STDM cable with 3 connectors on it, and have noticed in some threads that 3 cards are the limit with the STDM cable.

Is there anything I can do? I was thinking of making an STDM cable with four connectors, but that doesn't seem to be a possibility. I hope I've misunderstood!

Thanks,

Dan

[garyb]

don't bother with four. it won't be satisfactory...

[LCS AUDIO]

Greetings

I am actually using 3x 15 DSP cards + 1 x 6 DSP with full stability Total of 51 DSP.
I can fill the DSP meter with no isues. I am also using a minimum of 44i/o's at any given time.

I am using 3 STDM cables to link the cards as follows:
#1 links cards 1-2-3
#2 links cards 1-2-4
#3 links cards 2-3-4

Win 7 Pro 64bits
ASUS - P7F-C/4L, i7 880
16GB 2100MHz RAM running at 1333MHz
PNY NVS 450 quad DVI card
System SSD

Knock on wood!

Eric

[unaHm]

Thanks gentlemen!

Unfortunately Eric, the cards I have only have the single edge connector, so I can only use one STDM cable to link the cards. I wish I could upgrade - 51DSPs definitely sounds useful!

Gary, thanks for your response as always. Out of interest, what aspect of having four cards linked (or at least within the same system) do you find less than satisfactory? With the STDM cable, would it run out of connections? Or, is it due to PCI bandwidth limitations?

[garyb]

there are bandwidth problems, communication problems between cards and power supply problems. the PCI bus isn't supposed to support all those sharcs. there have been several people who have reported success with four cards so you can always try it, i guess.

[unaHm]

That makes sense. It sounds like the problem is on the border of what's considered to be the levels of tolerance. I might give it a try at some point, but it's left me thinking about trying to find newer cards instead.

I think I misunderstood initially that there was a limitation on the number of cards, but looking at the package size of the SHARC ICs it makes sense. A couple of the boards I have here were given to me free of charge, so it wouldn't cause any emotional anguish if I upset one

I remember being offered a free Dell server from around 2001, which had 8 PCI-X slots, and one PCI. Alas, PCI-X is only 3.3v so I couldn't use it. Still, there are some industrial boards out there that might be able to handle the power and bandwidth requirements, but I'd bet they're few and far between these days.

Thanks for the insight, and for now I'll see what I can do with 11 DSPs!

[LCS AUDIO]

You will still have lots of fun!

[dawman]

The number of I/Os makes it worth a try. I miss having so many as I had w/ 3 x Pros, but I don't miss being the whipping boy/FOH.

[unaHm]

Eric, I agree! I'm looking forward to experimenting with all of the synths, either those included with the licenses I have, or the free ones that are available on this forum!

I was intending on using the Luna, Pulsar and one of the SRBs for the systems I have with 3 PCI slots. I don't know how much of a difference having four more would be, but I suppose it could mean the difference between being able to use a Scope device (a complex one) and not.

The number of IOs does sound like a really cool aspect of this system, and maybe in the future I could combine 3 (4, 5...) Pulsars for all of those ADAT connections! At the moment I'm kind of limited because I only have the ADAT connectors on the Pulsar, but the Luna's excellent for the performance and it's DA outputs.

[bcslaam]

Have you considered using Pci expansion chassis. With the virtuvia for 269 euros you can choose your power supply for the box and motherboard. Since you are using pcie the modern boards are available.

[malcolmbarr]

I would like to ask garyb and any others who have an insight a question about the STDM cables and a 4 card set up.

I understand that going beyond 3 cards is not supported, may create problems, etc. But I already have 3 PCI cards (Pulsar 2, Pulsar 1 and Luna) and am likely to acquire another Pulsar 2 soon, and am willing to do a bit of experimentation to see if I get things to work with 4 cards. If it doesn't work, I am happy to choose the 3 cards I need and put them in one PC, and put the other(s) in another box.

My question is about the STDM cables and the PCI cards with only one edge connecter (Luna and Pulsar 1). By definition, that means these cards can only connect to two other PCI cards with a standard STDM cable with three connectors. My intention is to try two pulsar 2 cards, a pulsar 1 and a luna together with two STDM cables. One STDM cable will connect the two pulsar 2 cards and pulsar 1. The other will connect the pulsar 2 and the luna. This means the luna and the pulsar 1 will not have a direct STDM connection to each other.

So what information is the STDM cable actually carrying between the cards? Is it vital that all of the cards in the system have a direct STDM connection to each other? Is there an obvious reason why this set up would not work? Would a STDM cable with four connectors, if I could make one, make this work?

Any insight on this most welcome.

[garyb]

i'd just use one cable. in fact, i wouldn't do what you are doing, but...

Dante has gathered all the relevant cable data here:
http://www.hitfoundry.com/issue_10/stm_mast.htm

[yayajohn]

Why not just run 2 computers side by side? You can link them via ADAT and copperlan and treat it as an external synth or effects rack. Even if you don't have any extra plugs, just loading all the free devices will give you more than enough to make it worthwhile. Older computers/motherboards with XP are dirt cheap and you may find your 1st gen cards run better on the older motherboards.
I have a Pulsar 1 running on a separate p4 windows xp machine and I link it to my other 2nd gen cards and it has been no trouble at all.
Of course if you just like to experiment and tinker and try and get things to work together just for the sake of doing it, I can understand that. I like doing that as well.

Dan

[malcolmbarr]

Dan - You are right, running two boxes is an option. I actually have the components lying around to put another PC together. But I would rather not for a couple of reasons (a) it takes up more space in the room when you also think about another screen, and (b) there is the issue of keeping the box quiet (my main music making PC is completely passively cooled, and more passive cooling and PSU starts to cost).
And to be honest, I don't mind doing the tinkering either.
Running a second box remains a fall back option.

Garyb - Your suggestion is to make up a cable with 4 connectors and try that, right? The only problem i have with that is the Dante's STDM cable guide points to supplies that come from the US, while I live in the UK, and it seems a bit of a pain ordering from overseas. Since I will have a couple of three connector STDM cables to hand, I'll give that a try first and then report back. Should have the kit to do this next week.

[garyb]

how will a three connector cable work?

[malcolmbarr]

I will have two three connector cables. And I will have 2 pulsar 2 cards, 2 luna cards and a single pulsar 1 card to play with.

I was going to try the two pulsar 2 cards and the 2 luna cards first (having seen garyb's remark that the pulsar 1 cards don't manage pci resources as well as the newer cards in another thread). One stdm cable will connect the two pulsar 2 cards and one of the Lunas, the other cable will connect the two pulsar 2 cards and the other Luna. Any chance this will work, or will the fact that the two luna cards do not have a direct cable connection to other doom this to failure?

[jhulk]

rs components have the correct card edge connectors

also with 4 cards your going to get pci overflow problems as creamware tested it and 3 cards were max for the pci buss

[malcolmbarr]

jhulk - thanks for the tip on the edge connectors. You may well b right about the PCI overflows, although the report above by LCS AUDIO gives me some grounds for hope. I'll give it a try and see what happens.