Brexit

[Nestor]

Then you are understanding my words the wrong way, from the very bottom my brother

No, we cannot solve it here, sure not, but realizing what is going on is a good thing, because it gives you the possibility to act for a better life.

People might deny the fact that their politicians are corrupt people, but when you give them the right arguments, over and over again, they may at least have a chance to change their minds, which is a good thing. To see reality is always better than being in denial. I don’t lose hope in “people”, I have lost hope in the elites of the world, so I don’t consider my words empty or useless.

The following point is the one in which I have not relation whatsoever: “a war on PZ”, I have not the least interest on it, nothing at all.

Your last phrase does not really comes from you brother, but from the pressure Hubird has made over your mind for several years already telling you that, as a moderator, you cannot give your opinion. What an ill-advised line of thoughts! You are a free man, you can speak freely as you want to. You don’t need to say you are not speaking as a moderator or as a SC representative, shame on Hubird for that. You are a relaxed person with which it is a pleasure to speak with, don’t pay attention to the intellectual extortion he has posed onto you. Of course, I am not telling you what you have to do, but this really annoys me after so many years of hearing the same crap, so I am defending you openly.

[garyb]

no, Nestor, i do know that you have the best intentions and i'm not trying to censor those. as i said, i don't see anything wrong with you speaking your opinions or thoughts. i don't think there's anything wrong with those that disagree with you speaking their thoughts, either. that's how people come to understanding. i also don't want to make this a "pile on the Europeans" thing. these problems go beyond those people that we know and see and can point to with our fingers, imo.

yes, that last sentence was just to keep my role in speaking up, clear.

[Nestor]

I understand Gary, no problem

[Marco]

If the Xite hardware gets cheaper after brexit I say go for brexit TODAY, otherwise I give a shit.....

[Sounddesigner]

I'm sure this latest terrorist attack in France that happened yesterday is going to further change the minds of more people in France regarding their EU membership. Open borders/ Multi-culturalism and the whole EU paradigm does not work. Sadly there will only be more horrific events unless a meaningfull change is made because the world is incompatible with their utopian ideology. These horrible things keep happening cause the EU paradigm does not work, these horrific events are the proof of failure.

This latest terrorist attack was primarily done by a truck so it defeats the more gun-control arguement that many Liberals here in the USA use as they try to blame Citizen's Right-to-bare-arms as the reason for terrorist attacks. Intelligent people know that terrorists will still kill you even if they have no guns just like this guy in France who used a truck (and sadly killed 84 people with that truck). The Obama-Liberals here try to use everything they can as a scape-goat such as gun-rights to take attention away from the fact that their ideology and policies don't work. The 911 terrorists here in the USA used box cutters and airplanes NOT guns and that was the worst terrorist attack ever on American soil with over 3000 people killed.

The world is falling apart under this liberal world order and they still refuse to admit it doesn't work. Turkey's military are attempting a coup today and civil war may break out soon there. Turkey is needed by the West to fight Isis due to its strategic location. Rome is burning but denialists pretend that all is fine or that we simply need more of the broken ideology that has proven to not work. Both major political parties here in the USA has done major damage to our Nation and has caused it to decline greatly in multiple ways. Hopefully Americans learn from Great Britains people and start to vote wisely, as well as create another major party for greater choice.


EDITED

[hubird]

these horrific events are the proof of failure.

Hm, I don't think so, it's a proof of our belief in an open secular society

The biggest 4-day march of the world is just starting tuesday, accompanied by an tomorrow starting 7 day yearly open air music event spread all over the streets of the inner city where I live.
250,000 visitors a day.
Fingers crossed
But the authorities are prepared, already before the disaster in (was it) Dortmund where thousands of dance party people came across in a 'natural' fyke of a tunnel.
Meaning: electronic message boards where to go when it's full somewhere, no deadly obstacles or kerbstones in the (shopping) streets, etc. We get visitors from all over the world to get informed about handling massive people movements and calamities.
Not to show off, really, but it's always good to see the good things

[dawman]

The anti gun advocates in the current political scene are hypocrits when you research thier decisions.

Eric Holder could have stopped the guns from the USA to Mexico in 2009 when the violence was no longer "contained."
The program continued and 50,000 dead.
Mexicans are very respectful of tradition and the murderous thugs agreed to a cease fire when the Pope visited.

Obama and Clinton are staunch anti gun advocates yet they armed Syrian civilians with high caliber weapons which has resulted in 500,000 dead.

People wonder why citizens get pissed off at ANY laws these hypocrits want to pass.

Also nice to know the elites pushing globalism/open borderless societies and anti gun policies have nice big walls at thier mansions and armed gaurds.

I especially like the global warming shaming they do to the peasants as they fly above in their Lear Jets discussing what the rest of us should do.

As a good Sheep I follow our Shepards.
I do as they say, not as they do.

[hubird]

that gun theme doesn't even exist in Europe... to give some context...

The Vox Populi, the sheep, is heard again with the Brexit...
Austria could follow with the next -by the elite so gently allowed- repeated elections.

Ah, politics, it's so interesting, if you concentrate on the dynamic part of it
See how social democrat Bernie Sanders forced neoliberal Billary to the left, how beautiful

[hubird]

Sometimes I realise that 'local' differences are complicating chats like this one.

In example:
In the US Liberals are left, right? eh, I mean, yes?
Liberals are even socialists, as I've read here, the term social democrats isn't even an option.
Is that the right interpretation?

Assuming it is, I can just tell you that (neo-) liberals in Europe are considered to be the most right-wing parties, since the origins of our political system, say 120 years.
(Only new nationalist populists like Geert Wilders are placed to the right of the Liberals (VVD).
The Liberals are the typical defenders of the free market, the invisible hand according to Adam Smith in 1759.
Classic Capitalism, so to say. The Clintons sign for the globalisation optimism, but socialists?

The qualifications Socialist and Liberal can't be attributed to one political party at the same time.
What in the US often is called 'Socialists' are here the 'social democrats', like the PvdA in Holland and the SPD in Germany.
Mid parties, used to function in a coalition since many decades.
The Clintons have nothing to do with them, US Democrats are only 'progressive' on immaterial issues, just like our Liberals.

If you ask me where to put Bernie Sanders then, on my scale, it would be fermly left to the European social democrats of today, as they got lost in their diploma democracy alienation thing and fill in.
He would come close to the SP, formerly known as real socialists, now said to be sanctuari of the vox populi at the left side.
A mid party in the polls, btw.

And on a side track:
to read the posts of members from the USA I constantly need to construct a translation logic in order to follow the argumentation as meant:
Wait...their socialists are my very right Liberals...
Socialists as the kings of free market and globalisation?

Like JB said in Sex Machine: gimme the bridge
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8mjQ1i5V7qA

[Nestor]

Vladimir Putin has made it clear not long ago: That World War III is inevitable and will be started by the U.S. Putin blames America for destroying the “global collective security” and says american imperialism will cause the world to go to war. This scenario is HOT, to say the least! Russian military has been violating NATO air space apparently to test their ability to penetrate the NATO’s air defenses. There are at least 20 hot spots of confrontation between many countries right now: Russian vs Turkey, China vs Japan, USA vs Russia, then you have Ukraine, Syria, Egypt, France, Spain, Greece, England, Scotland, and so forth and so forth…, submerged into some very uncomfortable international political and economic problems. The world is right now a mess! Is it just by chance that China has asked their military to be ready for a potential big worldwide conflic? Everything I expected to happen, is happening exactly as I have expected.

[garyb]

i don't believe any of it. you're all crazy...

[hubird]

Everything I expected to happen, is happening exactly as I have expected.

Including the rape culture in Argentina?

[garyb]

well, the folks who set up all the Dutch colonies and raped Africa and the East Indies are the reason that it's so nice in the northern lands, and they're still in place, looking like the nicest, most reasonable people in the world, so...

there's subterfuge and people willing to have others suffer in all walks of life, from the bottom of society to the top. the ones at the top are the worst ones because they are concerned mainly with power. of course, they can be magnanimous to those that they depend on to be the power base. that only makes sense. to assume that all of them, or even most of them have good intent is either stupid, ignorant, or complicity, but i don't mind. order and technology are nice, to a degree. it's also foolish to think that the love will continue to flow the moment that people are no longer useful.

yes, you can trust the government and the people who run it, but you gotta watch them...

[hubird]

you bet!

[dawman]

We played the Sexual Assault Cruise to Aruba years ago.
A favorite place for young Dutchesses and Dukes..........

[hubird]

Explains why Aruba voted against (complete) independence in 1991...

[dawman]

Dude there's nothing prettier than the girls from Tobago....
A small area there has a klan of Chinese Spanish mixed folks.
Incredible babes.
I met one who raced boats between Trinidad and Tobago.
Just looking at here with that tight shiny skin and killer physique made my balls smoke...

[hubird]

you're privilaged

note: i used the term theme in gun theme, above.
I meant 'thema', item thus.
Theme sounds like 'a repeatedly mentioned tune', which wasn't my intention.

[dawman]

you're privilaged

That's what all these recent College Graduate Liberals keep telling me too.....
It's a new thing like safe spaces, and micro aggression, passive aggressive racism, etc.

Some guy I know was telling me a lazy dude with no manners had his foot out in the isle of a bus.
A black fellow came walking by and stepped over it.
That's called passive aggressive racism and privilege or some other nonsense.

Can't believe folks go into debt just to learn this shit that has no basis in reality.

In my world if you thought somebody was messing with you you catch him when he gets off the bus, beat the shit out of him and make him pay for another ride since you got off and must now pay to re enter the bus.

I feel sorry for these little darlings.
What will they do once they leave mommys basement and join the real world.
Only in make believe land at some University can they use this crap.

Engineering, Science, Medicine, those are real degrees.
Unless you specialize you'll probably have to settle for a job as a Grief Counselor.

[hubird]

Apparently I triggered something I had no idea of

Next time I just make it 'lucky guy', to be sure

you're privilaged

That's what all these recent College Graduate Liberals keep telling me too.....
It's a new thing like safe spaces, and micro aggression, passive aggressive racism, etc.

Some guy I know was telling me a lazy dude with no manners had his foot out in the isle of a bus.
A black fellow came walking by and stepped over it.
That's called passive aggressive racism and privilege or some other nonsense.

Can't believe folks go into debt just to learn this shit that has no basis in reality.

In my world if you thought somebody was messing with you you catch him when he gets off the bus, beat the shit out of him and make him pay for another ride since you got off and must now pay to re enter the bus.

I feel sorry for these little darlings.
What will they do once they leave mommys basement and join the real world.
Only in make believe land at some University can they use this crap.

Engineering, Science, Medicine, those are real degrees.
Unless you specialize you'll probably have to settle for a job as a Grief Counselor.