hubird wrote:[text edited
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I expected already a post like this
Which is good, I like the debate.
But I also like the discussion to be open.
'Slavery'? Na...
"
Slavery, yes
.. Free-speech and Freedom-of-the-Press were given partly as tools to stop our Government from growing more corrupt and tyrannical and has served as a good tool for doing just that in the past (like the impeachment of Richard Nixon). The internet is vital for Free-speech thus Authoritarians wish to further restrict it. Leave oversight with the US government and there is a better chance of the internet remaining a free platform since they have done a good job so far.
You act as if there is no types of slavery already here in the USA and around the world. Let me start with the worser forms of slavery around the world with countries with dictators.
There are many forms of slavery in existance today already some of wich few on both sides of the political spectrum would disagree with. I'm surprised you're not aware of some of the horrific things that are brought on the people of Totalitarian regimes in the past and today that easily constitute or equals slavery from murders, rapes, draconian violent acts, to control over everyday life to forced labour. You need to go have a good look into some of the more radical Communism, Theocracies, Monarchies. Any 1st world Nation like USA or Great Britain can degrade into the same conditions as the more radical 2nd/3rd world if Government is constantly arrogating more power. Our American forefathers knew a increasingly tyrannical government is one of our biggest threats to liberties thus they created a lot of safety barriers with our Constitution wich gives many freedoms for further protection.
You can decline so greatly from a free 1st world Nation and into a police state that the Government has basically complete control over you like has been demostrated presently and historically in other more 2nd and 3rd world countries. Extreme forms of Communism, Monarchies, Theocracies, etc can allow Government to have complete control over you to the point it tells you who to sleep with/marry, what career you must have, etc. You are powerless also cause it keeps you extremely poor and without money you can't really defend yourself against many threats. Forced to fight bogus wars and possibly even loose your life due to bogus Government control. You can be told you are only allowed to have a small number of children and if you exceed that number you can be beaten. Told what occupation you must have with Totalitarian governments. Without free speech to counter Government over-reach and put sunlight on it's most corrupt acts and true face its quite easy to insidiously decline into a police state like so many around the world right now where the Government can even kill you if it does'nt like what you're saying (this is the case right now in some countries). There is also Religious persecution from ungodly Totalitarian regimes. You're not aware of all the oppressions brought on by Totalitarian Governments? When a Government has that type of power over you that is without a doubt a form of slavery present and our freedoms and wealth here in the USA are slowly being whittled away at making us more and more similar to those Totalitarian regimes. The more our freedoms and wealth are taken the more we start to look like those more radical forms of government Nations.
WE DON'T HAVE TO WAIT FOR A 1st WORLD NATION LIKE THE USA TO DECLINE TO SEE EXTREME SLAVERY IN IT CAUSE THE USA ALREADY HAS SEVERAL TYPES OF EXTREME FORMS OF SLAVERY RIGHT NOW: Again, we do have abortions in our society wich means A GROUP OF PEOPLE HAVE NO RIGHTS. Abortions itself is equal to or even worse than slavery and it gives one person complete power over another like slavery.
We do have mass incarceration here in the USA and INCRACERATION IS A FORM OF SLAVERY. We have very bad incarceration policies WICH LEADS TO UNFAIR AND DRACONIAN TREATMENT TO SEVERAL DEMOGRAPHICS/LOWER-CLASSES IN OUR SOCIETY. The USA has more people in prison than any other country in the world INCLUDING THOSE WITH FAR MORE LARGER POPULATIONS. I do know that the average prison wages for work here in Wisconsin in the USA was around 0.35 cents a hour in the 1990's, if making you work all day for .35 cents a hour is not slavery than slavery does'nt exist and never has. I'm sure average prison wages have not increased that much since then. The Criminal Justice System is a dice roll and without money, political clout, etc it's too easy to be found guilty of something you did not do or to be over-punished for something you did do, while the elites are under-punished or not punished at all like Hillary Clinton and her scandles. Prison is slavery and when the Criminal Justice System is not operating all the way right a unfair slavery can come to many people.
THERE IS FINANACIAL-SLAVERY WICH LEADS TO MANY OTHER PROBLEMS INCLUDING PHYSICAL ONES: FINANCIAL SLAVERY GROWS WORSE AS GOVERNMENTS GROW MORE TYRANNICAL.
Americans make far less money then they think cause of all the taxes, Obamacare, credit-card-debt payments, college debt fees, etc all these things have people in financial bondage that worsens as the cost of living increases but wages remain stagnant and decreasing. There are many layers of taxes for some products you buy. When taxes are extremely high and you have high credit debt and high student-loan debt you are in financial-slavery cause you are working all day for far too little, and your wages are'nt even enough to truly live off of cause of all the debt/taxes/inflation/etc. America agrees with me cause our forefathers understood the oppression of over-taxation this is why they rebeled against Great Britain and started the Revolutionary war. Over-taxation is what brought about the very birth of America and the creation of the Declaration-of-Independance wich states "All people have a right to life, LIBERTY, and the persuit of happiness (that pursuit of happiness meaning property/prosperity). Financial-Slavery lead to the birth of America itself.
Our people are starting to struggle financially more and more as the middle-class disappears and more of this Nations wealth goes to the top 1%. Physical problems can occur without money cause you can't fight off unfair treatment without it. If the Government decides to Eminent-Domain and unfairly take your property you can't fight back in Court without money. If you are wrongly accused of a crime you can't adequately fight the case without money cause you need a lot of money for a good attorney and thus be unfairly imprisoned. You can't adequately fight sickness and some diseases without money, etc etc. Our Government has spent our nation into 20 trillion in debt and is always comming with more taxes (the latest being Obamacare). 50% or more of your work money can go to taxes and much of the rest to Student-Loans, Credit-Card-debt, and interest from financing house and cars.
When one is paid wages they can't truly live off of this is slavery cause you do a lot of hard work and get very little in return. Our middle-class is slowly disappearing and wages are less and less keeping up with the cost of living. As our middle-class slowly disappears drug-use increases cause Suburban Americans now feel the pains of those living in inner-cities. Opiods, Heroin, etc usage has been rapidly increasing, addictions is slavery itself as the user has no control, and addictions can turn a user into a sex-slave or penatentary-slave.
hubird wrote: I read an article in a serieus Dutch paper exactly about this.
It's argued for being quite a false alarm, Cruz and Trump are just shouting without knowing what they talk about.
Edward Snowden showed about the role of NSA regarding massive monitoring of digital communication, other countries in the world don't want that, therefor US should leave ICANN.
Tech mega companies like Google and Facebook do support leaving it too.
If not the risk would be that you get more than one system of internet dressing (the url uniformity).
Easy international communication for everyone would be the victim.
Dictators do already cut internet services, Russia, China, Turkey,Egypt, North Korea, etc.
Note: we should fight dictators, national protectionism will lead to nothing.
The earth is too small for that these days, the world
is already globalised, we 'just' have to find solutions in the long term for injustice and problems. That's my conviction
I read all kind of sources, but today people tend to stick to only one (kind of) source, their own internet bubble of truth.
Like this ultra right one, breitbart, with an heavily alarming article about the subject:
http://www.breitbart.com/national-secur ... -internet/
Informative read in The Washington Post:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fac ... -internet/
Their conclusion:
"The Pinocchio Test
Members of Congress play a valuable role in highlighting issues of concern, but there is always a risk that the rhetoric becomes so overheated that it loses credibility. Cruz goes too far in asserting that the ICANN transition will result in Russia or China being able to censor U.S. Internet content. ICANN is basically powerless to control content on the Internet, though it can decide which top-level domains are good or bad. But there are many checks and balances placed on that power.
The transition will result in governance changes, and some experts believe ICANN is too quick to suggest that the impact will be minimal. Any new governing structure will evolve over time, and in ways that cannot easily be predicted. But such nuances are lost in Cruz’s extreme stance. We can’t quite give this Four Pinocchios, but he’s leaning too far on his skis here.
Three Pinocchios"
Some of the Checks and Balances for ICANN are removed when a International-Community takes over mainly the American-People who is responsible for creating the freest Nation in the world and most successful in history. The naysayers come with a long list of problems that can occiur if Internet Oversight remains with the USA Government but act like no problems can occur with it in a Internation-community's custody wich is contradictory. Obviously there is power with the Overseer Position or the International-community wouldn't have been crying so hard for so long to get it out of America's custody. Naturally if problems can occur with America it can occur with them.
Censorship, etc can occur in creative ways such as if someone types in my web-address they may go to a different site instead.
American Government is not that trustworthy right now I agree but everything has been just fine with their oversite of the internet, they aren't that stupid yet. Global-international organizations never work that well (The UN, NATO, the EU). As a American Citizen I know our citizens can hold the American Government accountable to some extent at the polls but noone can hold these un-elected International Overseers accountable and once the Genie is out of the bottle there may be no getting it back in. Many Nations don't value our first Ammendment like we do (free speech) and thus will set out to censor us. Cybor warfare has already picked up in recent years with hacking, etc and this is just another method for Cyber War. And many Democratic Nations even don't allow for as much freedoms as America since they don't allow their citizens 'the right to bare arms'. Many Nations don't view freedoms the same way as the USA and offer it to varying degrees to their own people. I usually don't have much good to say about the American Government but for all of our's sake Internet Oversite is best left with them. The internet provides a important Avenue/platform for free-speech you don't want to gamble with that by taking a chance on the unknown since the known has worked for over 20 years.
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