Highs are -10db on left stereo side at 10k

Nikibuzz · Post by **Nikibuzz** » Fri Jun 11, 2004 3:16 pm

This is very strange.
If I pan a hihat from right to left the high freq's drop by at least -10db at around 10k

I'm using 2 pulsar II boards.
And it's consistent on three different set of speakers.
So it's definetly not my speakers.

Any suggestions?

Shayne White · Post by **Shayne White** » Fri Jun 11, 2004 5:00 pm

Are you running an outboard mixer? Are there any EQs somewhere in your setup that you missed? Which device is causing this? Check to make sure there aren't any plugins running that would cause it.

Nikibuzz · Post by **Nikibuzz** » Fri Jun 11, 2004 5:46 pm

No this happens with any sound that is 5 to 10k.
I tried deleting all effects eq's and just running a single hiat and nothing helped.

I am not running any outboard gear or mixers.

Thanks

rodos1979 · Post by **rodos1979** » Fri Jun 11, 2004 6:25 pm

Hello!

Try and see if the same happens with all your outputs (ADAT, SPDIF, Analog).

Maybe is a faulty cable... In any case you might have to send the card to be serviced but it is good to know where is the fault.

Nikibuzz · Post by **Nikibuzz** » Sat Jun 12, 2004 1:40 am

Yes.This happens on all outputs

This also happens with headphones.

[ This Message was edited by: Nikibuzz on 2004-06-12 02:42 ]

alfonso · Post by **alfonso** » Sat Jun 12, 2004 3:18 am

What are you using for panning? Wich mixer? did you try also with "Channel" or other mixers? Can you exclude a device?

Nikibuzz · Post by **Nikibuzz** » Sat Jun 12, 2004 4:16 am

This happens on all mixers
With all synths and audio files.

Nikibuzz · Post by **Nikibuzz** » Sat Jun 12, 2004 4:36 am

This is really puzzling for me.

The left side of the stereo field is-10db and 5k to 10k are dull as if a tissue where put over the tweeter.

I've tried all mixers and a large array of devices and the results are the same.

I've also removed the cards and cleaned them with alcohol and re-inserted them.

I even did a fresh re-install of SFP!

I've swaped the cables and still the same results.

The only thing I can think of is my computer is on 24/7 as I'm running a server.
This was not a problem before so............

Plato · Post by **Plato** » Sat Jun 12, 2004 4:37 am

Could it be a phase problem?......does it happen in all projects/all channels-mono & stereo?

Nikibuzz · Post by **Nikibuzz** » Sat Jun 12, 2004 4:45 am

Only Stereo

Plato · Post by **Plato** » Sat Jun 12, 2004 11:31 am

what happens if you use, say, the micro-mixer or single channel strip - the reason I ask is that you can be sure these mixers will be confined to one DSP chip, so phase errors will be extremely unlikely.

Nikibuzz · Post by **Nikibuzz** » Sun Jun 13, 2004 5:44 pm

The results are the same with all mixers.

Micro, channel etc.

voidar · Post by **voidar** » Tue Jun 15, 2004 10:59 am

Are you hearing or are you meassuring this? If so with what?

Nikibuzz · Post by **Nikibuzz** » Tue Jun 15, 2004 1:35 pm

I'm hearing this and using a software graphic EQ to compensate.

I have to create a bell eq curve from 5k to 10k at plus 10db in order to balance the eq and output of my Pulsar II cards

blazesboylan · Post by **blazesboylan** » Tue Jun 15, 2004 2:33 pm

Hi Niki.

This sounds very much like an amp or other problem (or tinnitus in one ear?

Kidding). Nevertheless there is a surefire way to check.

Pull in a 'Control Room' device into your SFP project.
Hook up the test signal output to a mixer of your choice, to both the left input and the right input on a single channel.
Hook up the same mixer L and R outputs to 2 frequency analyzer plugins (Edit: here's a link to one: Frequency Analyzer)
Go to the control room. Select 'sine wave' and set the frequency to, say, 10000 Hz. Turn the test signal "On".

If the problem lies within the mixer plugin itself, it should be visible here with the 2 frequency analyzers.

Since I seriously doubt that the mixer plugins are causing the problem, the next logical step is to test your analog ins and outs:

Remove the connections from the mixer L / R to the 2 frequency analyzers.
Connect mixer L / R to analog out dest.
Connect analog in source L / R to the 2 frequency analyzers.
Run a real-world cable from analog out to analog in.

This will tell you whether there's a problem with the CW hardware, if there's a noticeable discrepency between the 2 analyzers.

From the info you've given I would suspect the amplifier to be the culprit. Unless the headphones and the speakers are being powered by 2 different devices?

That's my $0.02. Good luck Niki!

Cheers,

Johann

[ This Message was edited by: blazesboylan on 2004-06-15 15:38 ]

voidar · Post by **voidar** » Wed Jun 16, 2004 4:12 pm

Well, if the above don'w work you could check your ears. I for instance believe I hear sounds clearer with my left ear while the right lacks something. But of course, this scenario would be a serious ear-injury.

Something I have noticed though is a delay in the right channel; when I play and stop winamp i.ex. I hear some repeats of the last audiostream in the right channel. I do not know if this is the reason for the hearing anomaly I have stated above or not.

Nikibuzz · Post by **Nikibuzz** » Thu Jun 17, 2004 2:41 am

I sincerly thank you all for your response.

Maybe I should explain. Monday I took my monitors(Spirit Absolute 4P's) in
for repair because I thought the left side tweeter was damaged.

So friday I bought a new pair of Edirol's MA10d and plugged them in and to
my surprise I had the same problem with less high's on the left so I am 100%
sure it's not my speakers.

As you can see both set of monitors are powered.

The Edirols are new so unless there is a strange coincidence it can't be my speakers.

I used an analyzer as suggested and it's not the software so I must conclude that it's the cards themselves.

Counterparts · Post by **Counterparts** » Thu Jun 17, 2004 2:47 am

Nikibuzz wrote:

I sincerly thank you all for your response.

Maybe I should explain. Monday I took my monitors(Spirit Absolute 4P's) in
for repair because I thought the left side tweeter was damaged.

Are the monitors and headphones both being driven from a mixer? If so, perhaps the problem lies there?

edit: sorry - just saw your note about no outboard gear / mixers :-/

Royston

I'd try recording something out of SFP's mixer(s) to a .wav file (e.g. in Cubase), burn that onto a CD and play the CD on an independant system.

[ This Message was edited by: Counterparts on 2004-06-17 03:48 ]

blazesboylan · Post by **blazesboylan** » Thu Jun 17, 2004 4:32 am

In retrospect, pink noise would have been the better option to use in the Control Room device (rather than 10 KHz sine wave). Easier to see in an octave-based spectrum analyzer.

Let's back up a bit, Nikibuzz -- you mentioned earlier that the Analog, ADAT and SPDIF outputs from the CW card all produce the same effect. Also when you're using headphones. But each of those (ADAT, SPDIF, headphones) requires a different output routing, not to mention different cable and a different intermediate device (ADAT D-A, D-A, headphone amp).

So I just want to make absolutely sure you really have tested all of those configurations?

If so then this is very strange indeed.

Try hooking up mixer out Left -> right speaker; and mixer out Right -> left speaker. What happens then?

I still do recommend you try running SFP mixer -> analog out -> cable -> analog in -> SFP spectrum analyzer. This will tell you for sure whether or not the problem is in the CW hardware.

(See previous post but use pink noise rather than 10 KHz sine wave.)

In any case bonne chance Nikibuzz! Hope you won't have to pay for tweeter repair...!

Johann

Nikibuzz · Post by **Nikibuzz** » Thu Jun 17, 2004 9:39 am

Hi Guys,

I maybe should have mentioed that I have 2
A16's so that's how I'm able to test all the configurations headphones etc.

Again the only amps involved are the ones in the powered monitors which on one set of monitors are new.

Have any of you tried to boost 5 to 10k on a hihat and then pan it hard left and hard right and see if there's a difference?