future of scope?

astroman · Post by **astroman** » Fri May 26, 2006 7:28 am

I don't read any rant - the questions at the beginning of the thread are reasonable and probably a lot of folks ask themselves in a similiar way.
It doesn't hurt to learn a bit about the background of DSP coding and DSP hardware either, along the way.

regarding (possible) Scope customers noone will spent one or more k Euros on an obscure description that's contrary to all industry and marketing preaches and even some of the 'leading' musicians' statements

of course, after the Scope experience one knows better...

the sales of Scope itself are certainly less than one would appreciate, but on the other hand this may lead 'competitors' to (possibly) looking down on the company with regret

cheers, Tom

astroman · Post by **astroman** » Fri May 26, 2006 7:46 am

On 2006-05-26 02:40, organix wrote:
...In my opinion, ProTools for example is a product that is comparable and maybe better, but for a higher price...

I see your point, you probably have 'productivity' in mind.
Scope is in fact a bit 'spread all over the place' in this context.
I don't have ProTools myself - but I wouldn't hesitate to buy an old (Mac based) one if, yes if there were silent SCSI disks...

But afaik PT doesn't have Scope's free routing capabilities, while Scope lacks the integration of the very good, yet isolated VDAT recorder.

On the other hand this would never be a ready-to-mass-market solution anyway, so possibly a better automation and other improvements in this context might be a niche for ambitious 3rd parties (OEM)

cheers, Tom

lagoausente · Post by **lagoausente** » Fri May 26, 2006 12:30 pm

Lago - if you had MIDI timing and crackling problems with Scope, then it's a fault of your system

I have just told reverse. I told I´m not having any problem with Scope, and was refering to sofware VSti, and samplers in general. I´m telling Scope is better for me than sofware. Really hate when people reply before reading.

darkrezin · Post by **darkrezin** » Fri May 26, 2006 12:32 pm

Chill out dude, I just misunderstood the language in your post. Apologies.

craighuddy · Post by **craighuddy** » Sat May 27, 2006 12:25 pm

So yeah, nah, sorry, calling the SSE/etc instructions "DSP cores" really wasn't anywhere near a stretch, they're pretty much the exact same kind of technology and circuit architectures.

I still maintain that DSP by definition is a seperate piece of hardware with seperate discrete inststuction sets. SSE etc qualifies for the second requirement but not the first. Your first "choice" quote as much as says such. Having it do "DSP like" funtions does not make it a dedicated DSP.
From your own links:

"The main difference between SIMD and DSP is that DSPs were complete processors with their own (often difficult to use) instruction set, whereas SIMD designs rely on the general-purpose portions of the CPU to handle the program details, and the SIMD instructions handle the data manipulation only. DSP's also tend to include instructions to handle specific types of data, sound or video for instance, whereas SIMD systems are considerably more general purpose."

I obviosly am not going to change your mind about this any more than you are going to change mine. That said, lets move on to the topic at hand and not hijack this thread any more than we have

[ This Message was edited by: craighuddy on 2006-05-27 13:28 ]

lagoausente · Post by **lagoausente** » Sun May 28, 2006 3:31 pm

We are really not on the problem. If Creamware have been on economic problems, it´s logical that they may have problems to do things, and probably they have been working on devices like Dynatube to get money.
Here, PlanetZ is full of Creamware users that loves the SFP advantages. In this world of competition, we all can make good marketing over the audio forums, about what goods we have on SFP. One thing is think it, but we must do it, if we want to have Scope alive.
Creamware company seems far away from this forum, but would be good they were near us.
If Creamware dies, we will suffer the lost. We can help, I think, but anything more that be speaking each other about how good is Scope. Other users must know it, and we can make them know it. But they are not on this forum. I know it sounds like prophet, but if we want Scop alive, must try something different than waiting..

[ This Message was edited by: lagoausente on 2006-05-28 16:33 ]

Post by **garyb** » Sun May 28, 2006 4:23 pm

true.

paulrmartin · Post by **paulrmartin** » Sun May 28, 2006 4:49 pm

I've noticed quite a few post by newcomers.
That is the future Creamware is looking for.

Post by **hubird** » Sun May 28, 2006 6:12 pm

about OSX support:
http://www.planetz.com/forums/viewtopic ... t=0#145171

lagoausente · Post by **lagoausente** » Mon May 29, 2006 12:39 pm

On one of my first posts on PlanetZ, before have buyed the card, was asking about what to buy. I told, "I really will not need many DSPs"
A guy replied me: he he he, that´s what all they tell at first..
He had reason, I´m missing more DSPs.
For now, seems not very dificult for me, make little publisment. I´m a Cubase SX registered user, just make a search on SX forum for example: cracks, pops, latency..
Find a some recent threads for people with problems, just reply about SFP advantages, Dynatube, Synths, Effects, instruments like B-003, Minimax, all with solid performance.
Hope anyone else take the idea, and do the same.

arela · Post by **arela** » Mon May 29, 2006 1:49 pm

Yiippii
Today is my Powersamplers 6 years birthday.

I deceided to change my Turtle Beach Daytona to Creamware (by accident), and i must say i had some doubts on my way.
First, my old Daytona recordings sounded really bad, secondly it took a while to be "friend" with the software.
First it was installed in a IBM P2 450mHz, then a AMD 1,2mHz and last 3 years Intel 2,4mHz
The Luna software was ok, but i have to say after all cards got the same SFP software, a new world opened.

.....still expanding!
.....more and more exciting!

why stop now?

My guess; i'll see you all around next year too!

erminardi · Post by **erminardi** » Mon May 29, 2006 2:12 pm

It's the 6th year for my LunaII Elektra too!!!

Before I was a Tripledat owner (whith my group...It was so expensive...)
First group's album was rec/mixed with a Pentium 200Mhz MMX, 128 Mb ram, 500mb HD, with Triple DAT enviroment!!!
Then my second solo album was relased with LunaII Elektra and Pentium III 600Mhz, 500 Mb ram, 40gm HD.
All final mixing/mastering was done with Protools and several outboards like Trident mixer, Manley Mastering variable mu Compressor, etc.
This year is the 10th anniversary with Creamware's products!!!
Wow!

Happy anniversary to me!
Thanks Creamware!

lagoausente · Post by **lagoausente** » Tue May 30, 2006 9:37 am

.....still expanding!
.....more and more exciting!

why stop now?

Maybe if they loose money, or simply if they not win money enough to contiue.
Invite all you to expand your happy birthdays to other forums.
I´m talking about making marketing in favor of this platform. Perhaps sounds inocent, but today, marketing is probably more important than what devices really can do.
There is people that study this as a profession. We can do it for free, it may only take some minutes, with a simple reply on a audio forum.
Sadly, when all we start on this world, we are quite lose about what to buy, what to go for, and here is when many people buy for what they have heard, or what marketing promise.
I have found here what I needed, but it was no so easy. This site is quite hidden.
Think also that there is a big distance between what SFP can do, and the result of total Creamware users. I think if where just, should be massive users. I thinking about how many people spends money on a Audigy, what costs 10 times the price of a SB live, and to just the same, unless the Audidy has jacks on the front of the PC. For some more money thant an Audigy, you can buy a Scope Home, but reality of marketing is there, and as you know, lot of newbies go into Pc stores to buy the Audigy as a "professional 5.1 suround bla bla bla"

bill3107 · Post by **bill3107** » Wed May 31, 2006 2:02 am

we are consumer and customers for steinberg, Natvie instruments and of course creamware... We all know that. As for the future we know quite nothing about it...

As for me i consider that - if you look at the vst price and what they consume (all your CPU !!!!), my creamware system is perfect : many plug ins included (very good synth 200 € worth each...) thanks to version 4.5, a perfect flexibility (Protools, uad, power core cannot afford that!)... For the price, i have a comprehensive studio in my Pc.

If you want to reach the power and the tools range of a creamware system, you will find out that it will cost you a lot more. Soooo.... i Keep my creamware system and avoid all the ads that encourage to drop your gear every year for a "brand new"...

astroman · Post by **astroman** » Wed May 31, 2006 3:40 am

On 2006-05-30 10:37, lagoausente wrote:
...This site is quite hidden.
Think also that there is a big distance between what SFP can do, and the result of total Creamware users. ...

well, imho this site has a pretty good google ranking (considering it's 'exotic' main subject), as I frequently stumbled across it when searching for items in completely different context (not Scope related at all)

the total number of Creamware users is a bit tacky (so to say,,,).
Of course not every CWA customer is a member of a forum, but you can bet that they didn't count a radio station (for one of their broadcast solutions) as one customer... they most likely extrapolated to the staff of the department that runs the software - 1k items sold, 10k users

cheers, tom

[ This Message was edited by: astroman on 2006-05-31 04:41 ]

darkrezin · Post by **darkrezin** » Wed May 31, 2006 4:59 am

Lago - deluded consumers like your friend in the other thread about the Emu card will always exist... people who think they know it all after reading Sound On Sound or a bunch of press releases from Musikmesse.

These kinds of people will never appreciate what a Creamware system can do - they just want quick results by using lots of presets. They also like the 'security' that a known-brand system like TC, UAD etc brings.

This is all because they do not have the knowledge to think for themselves. I don't think marketing Scope to these people is going to work.

More importantly, why is it such an issue to defeat every other platform? Different platforms will always exist, because people are different.

valis · Post by **valis** » Thu Jun 01, 2006 5:27 am

Here in the US television is written to the 8th grade level. Mainstream radio isn't too far off of this, but in the case of television shows it isn't just because they're going for a young demographic. It's because as you age your tastes splinter so much, that they're going for a "Lowest Common Denominator" that will allow the broadcast coverage of the audience with fractured tastes.

Not everyone perhaps NEEDS what scope can offer. So to cover what these people might need or want Scope would have to be expanded so the number of 'features' that their software supports and/or includes expands the market for Creamware. Scope is a rather complex piece of gear, at least for the initial learning curve. To improve usability so that people who don't need the full depth to access the features they care about there would have to be simplification somewhere.

It is far more likely that when this is done the result will be a system with less depth and fewer strengths, than it is to assume that every user who has needs or wishes that exist outside of the current core strengths of the Scope platform will find their needs met, and that Creamware will still have time to innovate on their strengths in addition to meeting the needs of their presumably expanding market.

[ This Message was edited by: valis on 2006-06-01 06:29 ]

dawman · Post by **dawman** » Fri Jun 02, 2006 1:35 am

It is my duty to punish the weak rigs of Las Vegas w/ Scope. Since Janruary I decided to play locally, as opposed to being an overpaid sideman. I am my own boss. Thanks to Scope I have a solid analog/digital rig which inficts serious pain to the generic rigs on stages throughout this town. I have had more people wanting in on Scope from hearing my rig, more than the Oberheim combo they were previously punished with. These guys are young and want a simple life of presets. That is where the ASB's come into play. That I believe is Creamware's future. Hybrid DSP based ASB's. If they sucseed in these endeavors, I believe they will continue to thrive, therefore good things will happen 4 us also. But CW seems to forget the huge dynamic economy of the Americas. If they would run adds over here a little bit more, it would prove to be economically viable. It will go like this....

Some DJ/Hip-hop brotha' with his pants pockets below his asscrack playing one note (in lower registers of course) on the Minimax through 4 big sub's while a fine young ho walks by and has her skirt raised from the awesome amount of SPL's coming from the cabs. The Brotha's like it, then the young white/latinos like it, cause they all are acting like the brothas nowdays, then the ho's see it and like it, then the parents hate it cause the brothas like it,..sucsess. That Dog Will Hunt. What Say You Creamware. Can You Afford To Bypass This Obese Economy Second Time Around? NOT!!

Just Another Scope Junkie Wanting CW 2 Sucseed,

_________________
Jimmy V.

[ This Message was edited by: scope4live on 2006-06-02 02:37 ]

Shroomz~> · Post by **Shroomz~>** » Fri Jun 02, 2006 1:50 am

Jimmy, I don't suppose your signatures are all some kind of puzzle or individual anagrams? Nah, surely you wouldn't be that devious as to stick hidden meanings in your posts.

JimmyV ... man or myth, he's a legend with an agenda!! >>> JIMMY V FOR PRESIDENT <<<

all hail

dawman · Post by **dawman** » Fri Jun 02, 2006 2:22 am

Please,...Stay Seated.