The monster of atomic war is upon us, again...

[valis]

Well checking back in here....starting back with my part on page one:

Hmmm

I am dissapointed valis about this lopsided US minded view.
Forget the usual evil elite alibi for a moment.
What is amazing is that you state FED and US gov bailed Europe, and China ? and...
US are worse than Greece (and Spain and Italy and..) in terms of national debts per BIP and in in total of the national debt and in terms of national debt per capita.

Well if you find my view 'lopsided US minded' then you should check out some of our mainstream news outlets who seem to give us tiny anti-Iranian & anti-Chinese soundbites (mixed in with some kerfluffle about our borders whilst ignoring the illegal arms trading that was apparently going on from certain "Fast and Furious" ATF groups...). Mostly of course it's pop-culture and who is divorcing/marrying/murdering etc who in the music/entertainment biz (you know, News!).

The TRILLIONS that have gone from our Fed. Reserve to EU were only disclosed because a partial audit was *finally* allowed, and of course the recipients are still mostly undisclosed. This isn't a bailout from any US politician or anyone I have the ability to elect or have input with mind you, it's a board of bankers by the bankers...and it's been underway since 2008 just as our local 'dispensing' of future earnings (debt) and printing of 'free' (debt bearing) money has been.

Btw if you want to critique the culture of debt we live in here, try living among us for a while and doing more than living as a nomad. Beyond paying meager rent somewhere and keeping a small store of food for the next several days on hand, there's not much you can do without incurring debt (unless you come to the party wealthy from the get go I suppose). That's unfortunately in stark contrast to 40-60 year ago when most homes, cars and appliances were able to be paid for without bearing debt, and I am not really a fan of the way things are working out on that front... In fact one of the things you'll read about in the history books here in the US in regards to the great depression is how it's all the fault of the little man wanting to buy his wife a fridge 'on credit' without exercising his prudence over his budget. And so I wonder if the same thing will be repeated now, when we're currently bearing 70 times the amount of banking fraud that we had in the savings & loan scandals in the 1970's. A casual tv viewer or headlines reader only knows that the mortgages are somehow related, and has to choose whether it's the fault of the 'guy who took the bad loan' or the 'guy who wrote the bad loan' while either perspective is both vastly oversimplified and at the same time represents only the smallest fraction of the fraud that's really been afoot.

And on a personal note, I am not a great earner where I live, I have a lower middle class existence where I don't buy luxuries very often and most of my earnings that are left from housing & food go to buying the tools I use to do my work (graphics & audio both, and computers). And even with highly variable earnings and a small business owner's needs, I was able to resist having any personal debts of any measure until my wife and I lost an unborn child last year very late in the pregnancy (which I haven't ever spoken of here) and found myself on the 'hook' for 26 large, something I've been working feverishly for the last 1.5 years to pay off...and that's after insurance took care of the normal hospital fees. So probably not the best subject for me to handle atm...and don't get me started on my thoughts on the medical establishment...having grown up around doctors, nurses for most of my childhood. And in military households which brings me back to...

[valis]

Anyway enough asides, what I was suggesting is that Nestor's impressions about the current 'buildup' over Iran isn't really fanciful imo. Not sure if I'd go so far as to call on WWIII signmakers yet, but we've spent the last decade (US and so-called "coalition forces") surrounding Iran from mostly all sides, we've been 'playing' war games north of Iran for a decade longer (Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan, Kazakhstan and of course leading up to Afghanistan post 2001) which imo is more about the precious metals and 'practice' that our elite troops got in the mountainous terrain. Now at a time when it seems we'll have to "leave" Iraq there's a convenient escalation with all things Iranian 'behind the scenes' from the US Media at least.

I do hope that this is just another round of chest thumping but there's been a few pawn moves on the chessboard which I mentioned already. I felt that these things were 'related' even though they're not really showing up in our accessible western media. We only get the 'downed CIA drone' and 'invaded British Embassy' stories to act as propellent on any anti-Iranian fires that may be stoked, and the IAEA results of course. None of the other things I mentioned are available without going to 'alternative' sources of information (web, talk radio, overseas news etc)....

Or were you somehow under the impression that I thought we *should* go to war with Iran? Still not 100% clear on your response...

[garyb]

.

[valis]

Thanks for the condolences, was certainly a learning experience. And yes the ones 'playing' with the volatile market are making an absolute killing imo. When the 2008 'crash' came, the number of put options that were placed the day before the crash completely dwarfed the pre 911 ones. The same thing happened co-incidentally on the day that the stockmarket experienced the 'computer based burp' in 2010 (which was due to Universa Investments putting a large number of trade options electronically, along with others that have never claimed their puts). And it's recently come to light that several brokerages were aggressively trading against the crash (ie, looking to profit by it) in 2008 rather than stemming the tide of their own holdings...that congressional staff (specifically senators) have no qualms about using information gleaned from their position (insider trading to the rest of us)...and the mortgage bundling that was occurring is still only a small fraction of the fraud that is and has been afoot, while most of the bandying about has been focused either on it or a handful of distractions (first Martha Stewart, then Bernie Madoff...) while there have been absolutely *zero* cases brought to bear let alone convictions. Actually that's not true, someone was fined 26million (name escapes me atm) which was but a small fraction of the earnings made during the time periods he was 'investigated for', and the terms of the 'fine' that was levied stated that he was cleared of all wrongdoing! Sadly I'm recalling this stuff off the cuff rather than posting links as they occur...

Anyway I think the current Fed involvement in the EU is interesting in light of this discussion because the timing of things the last few months seems rather like...it could be possibly a 'shoring up' of 'coalition forces' in preparation for some 'fun'. And there's been plenty written in the past about people who use ill gotten gains to fund 'small war', why not a big 'un? I have dim recollections of spring 2001 seeing an announcement that '600 million has "disappeared" from the economy' (aka the dot com bust) and then things seemed positively stagnant until 911 and suddenly a '600 million dollar funding bill' was passed for invading afghanistan. The numbers were repeated enough both times it seemed slightly less than coincidental...at least to me.

Oh and there was a think tank that investigated the EU situation earlier this year and decided they needed 10x as much as has already been disbursed to 'stabilize the economy' in the EU. Roll the printing presses please! (ugh)

[Nestor]

I lost an unborn child last year very late in the pregnancy

I’m deeply sorry for that Valis. Losing a pregnancy in its late stage when there is already a connection with the child, must be quite strong. I hope you are both well now.

A very enriching text. Personally, this is the kind of communication I’m looking for with people, through an expression which is free of violence and full of sincerity. This is the kind of talking that can bring us deep thought and final understanding, which in its ultimate significance HUMANIZES, thank you for that.

[Nestor]

some reason in the rhetoric...
market crashes are profit making playgrounds.

This is a mayor truth! I have seen it by myself happening once and over and over again in several countries. After a few years, when the same game was played again, you already knew that such and such a country would come down to earth, through the same method. One of the tricks has been giving credit cards to almost everyone in the world, to people without money that are desperate for anything like a new TV set or a couple of chairs, or even worse, for extremely expensive health care attention. The second one, MORTGAGES, (the terribly one I would say), which have destroyed thousands of families already in the USA, that now is destroying hundreds in Spain..., unfortunately is coming down fast.

[garyb]

sure.
some 40-60 years ago, no one had a mortgage in the USA unless something went very wrong in life or the person was very young. also, somehow if one were a gas station attendant, one could afford a two week vacation every year, one's wife did NOT have to work to make ends meet and the children could afford to go to college, if the parents were reasonably wise about their money. now, with both parents working, there is never enough. credit and the banking industry are largely the cause because "credit" is generated from non-existant money added into the system, but that's a whole other pot of coffee.

"government through random acts of violence"...meditate on that idea, look at the soldiers, the ghettos, the competition between people who really need to cooperate, look at the weapons and the lunatics that go on killing sprees and you'll see what that means....it's a "protection racket" like the kind the mafia offers, insurance..."you know, that life is so nice for you. it would be so tragic if something should happen to it. tell ya what, just pay me everything you have and your family lives."

[Nestor]

It’s really sad what you say Gary, I’m sorry for my fellow American people, you don’t deserve it. But even under this pressure, you still have a pretty high status in the States, at least, for quite a few million people still, but many countries around the world are entering into a survival era, sort of the 30s in USA, and there is no short term solution for them, like Greece for instance.

About 3 days ago we’ve got here an international report telling us that Chile has the biggest difference in the world when comparing people’s wages, being the difference of up to 27 times higher comparing the earnings of the working guy with the owner of the business. This is the general “standard”. In some isolated cases we can go up to 100 times higher in the difference of that income. This is mad!

How could this ever be an enduring, solid ground for people to live a life? It will never be solid this way, it is impossible. Many people can hardly get to the end of the month…, and I’m not talking about living, but surviving, which is pretty much different.

Uprisings are everywhere now, spreading like fire, and I cannot but support them, as long as they are not violent, this “economic template” must come to an end, no choice.

[siriusbliss]

saber rattling is the classic way to trump up war and brainwash the masses into compliance.
It's a classic Hegalian tactic that's been done throughout history - all cultures, countries, tribes, sects, etc. are the puppets to this contrivance.

War is the only remaining known way to justify debt and expenditures, and to mask the collapsing global economies.

It also keeps our eyes off the slow-motion atomic bomb after-effects from the Japan earthquake/tsunami/nuke-plant implosion that his hitting EVERYONE around the globe right now. Food supplies, water, products, ocean water, etc. is all being effected.

So SCREW the war-mongers. There are much more severe issues at stake.

G

[Nestor]

It's a classic Hegalian tactic that's been done throughout history
G

It has been proven that communism has been created and based upon the Hegalian method. Nevertheless, curiously, there are millions of followers still..., how sad...

[siriusbliss]

It's a classic Hegalian tactic that's been done throughout history
G

It has been proven that communism has been created and based upon the Hegalian method. Nevertheless, curiously, there are millions of followers still..., how sad...

...and followers that don't know that they're following...

G

[Nestor]

Don’t worry Stardust, be cool and take it with some humor, don't spend so much energy in something worthless, have fun

In what respects to me, I’m having fun with you, your mind is so overcomplicated to me that I have to read your stuff at least a couple of times to start understanding your writing… Ufff…

Let me cool you down with a joke, right?

I can imagine you having dinner in a public place, at the moment of asking for some salt, sort of:

You ask for salt:
“You, people of the world, listen to me (talking to the poor guy by the table looking at you with a hamburger into his hands), these white tiny granulations that sleep relentlessly into the flack when you move it with your fingers up and down, will give me the opportunity to flatten the vibrations of this circle full of nurture with which I’m getting involved so to overcome appetite (a plate with a humburger), handle it to me so I can improve the perspective from which taste is trying to communicate with my ribonucleic acid in the left side of my brain at the level of the cerebellum in my DNA rhythm pendulum (the hunburger is short on salt)”

The other guy says: Whaaa ya talking about dude?

Then you say (translating your words): “Can you pass me the salt please?”

Answer: “Ha, it was that what you just said?”

You say: “Yes, but you didn’t understand me, because you are a negative person that believes that the owner is a bad guy, without real understanding about what salt is”

And the poor guy tells you: “I’m only eating a hamburger…, and it is bloody expensive”

[Nestor]

And then try to laugh about yourself

I coudn't agree more with this one... I honestly don't need to try, I am constantly laughing at mayself, of course. We are all going to die anyway, so what? Yes, taking it easy it is part of a good philosophy of life, but mixed with a deep sense of responsability, of course.

Thank you for being friendly.

[garyb]

that was freindly?

that was condescending and quite hostile.

laugh at myself? that's easy, i'm a clown. laugh at the Queen? that's easy too, but it's also not funny.

resignation? who's resigned? to say that reality isn't what it is is just stupid, though. i'm pretty damned stupid, but not stupid enough to get caught up in Pengloss reasoning, though. i know stardust, you just want me to never talk where you can hear/see it again.

[Nestor]

that was freindly?

Gary, don’t through gas onto the fire… I’m doing a good job

[garyb]

[Nestor]

[Nestor]

There is a saying that states:

"There is no worse blind than the one than does not want to see"

Well…, it seems that the very first idea of this threat is coming to be true after all:

History is repeating itself, the biggest changes in Europe since 1945 have come to be right now. The Euro is under extreme pressure! Europe is divided now into ferocious interests and England is trying to save itself from the mess. Germany interests go against Israel, and Israel is of course getting against Germany; add to this that the Arab world is getting together becoming stronger and better organized than ever before in history. Finally, a huge economical fall is coming the following months for several countries in Europe... What does all this mean? What will it happen then? The same as always…, time goes by but we seem to be incapable of learning the lessons of our wrong history, and like brainless robots will go to war again, but this time of course, with much more powerful weapons.

They want to shut internet freedom. They want to make a single leadership in Europe
They control all the big money in the world. They have just put into action in USA this egoist law that says they can imprison you indefinitely against all your rights, etc.

Don’t you think that something really weird is going on? Are all these chance coincidences? Common!

Add to this that this is the proven way big money is controlled: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FS9pBja2 ... r_embedded#!

Now, this new is of a tremendous importance and will decide how the entire world will move in the following months:

http://www.economist.com/blogs/charlema ... -eu-summit

http://www.amnation.com/vfr/archives/021182.html

http://www.thecommentator.com/article/4 ... erman_mind

Something big is moving behind the scenes................................................

[garyb]

Nestor, war is like Captain Zap Brannigan says, "i'll fight you to the last drop of my men's blood!".

economic excuses are well and good, but somehow the machine still gets funded, even in the middle of the very worst of economies. i want to be able to fund my business so freely.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tXb9L8LW4XI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EQfX-5mcZuA

[Nestor]

Serious statment of the Russian prime about missiles:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OI5CWfwxcJQ