It's been a long time since I've done one of these serious posts.. Here's the deal. I'm going through some very tough times. Some of you may recall I was going to a school in Miami to get my master's in the music technology program yes? Well, after a semester of study, I've decided that it wasn't worth my money and quit as of this summer.
What happened was, there were only 3 students in the grad program, including myself. Everyone but me, had full time jobs which means it was near impossible to start off anything extracarricular. The number 3 also poses another problem... Since every class needs atleast 3 people for it to be taught, there were always undergrads taking the classes... And the undergrads were being taught max/msp before then even knew what Cubase and MIDI was. Anyway, it was all mixed up and nothing seemed to be working right. Stuff you don't see when you're visiting.
Anyway, I left school, without even being able to make any musician friends, partially because there were so little who actually wrote music, and now I'm kind of left alone here in Miami. It's the first time in my life that I realised that I was almost totally cut off from the musician's circle.
You know how you do the "what if you were deserted on an island" questions for fun? Well, I think this is pretty much it. I'm deserted with no musicians around at all. The only connection I have is PlanetZ.
Anyway, me being deserted poses a couple of problems. First, I'm starting to loose interest. It's strange but after all these years you'd think I have a near static state of interest/motivation, I even thought so too.. But I can see that it can be shattered, or atleast degraded by conditioning.
Imagine this, for close to a year, the only audience you have is a non-musician that is less than enthusiastic about music itself. Every time there is no response, or the equivalent, meaning, the person could care less. This type of conditioning is pretty painful and deadly I think, since there's nothing to counter it.
So my conclusion for now is that audience is very important in the long term.. it helps balance and retain values. Not that I don't have internal values, I think it's a combination of the internal ones and external ones. I mean, criticism from other musicians is always a good thing..
Here's the thing, I know I can learn and do my jig with no one around, but it's as effective as walking around in the darkness. Limited info, loose site of your self image (as a musician), values that get distorted easily.. Kind of like a hermit. My conclusion? It seems like music is a social thing, atleast to me. Or maybe that's the part that I enjoy the most, the way it brings people together and causes clashes and fusion of creative energy.. collaboration and friendship, honor for each other's craft and technique, things like that. Music is a cultural construct, so naturally, you need a group of people to keep it intact.
Of course, this is a very biased view since I'm in a special situation.. but I hadn't realised these things up till now. I always thought I could be a solo player when I had a bunch of musician friends around, untill I really became solo.
I am fighting to find my self a good circle of people so I can start socializing and making musical connections.
a social musician? Do you need people to compose
-
BingoTheClowno
- Posts: 1722
- Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2003 4:00 pm
- Location: Chicago
- Contact:
-
hubird
time is required wherever you are, sometimes more, sometimes less...
the audience is VERY important. music is ultimately a social experience, even if it seems disconnected from society from time to time. without a listener, it can be pretty pointless. anyway, who says that you need to spend all your time making music to be a musician? you need time for ideas to ripen. of course, you're going to be in a dry spell if classes are suddenly over. all your energy was gathered for this, and now, you need a new target. don't rush it, one will come.
maybe it would have been good to finish the seemingly pointless program, just for the certificate....at any rate, it's hard to meet new people, even in an area with a big scene. people are often slow to warm to newcomers, especially within a scene. it takes time to discover the secret social conventions and passwords so that you can even get in the door.
even if you decide to move somewhere else, patience.....you have a lot of life ahead...
why not go visit the grand canyon?
the audience is VERY important. music is ultimately a social experience, even if it seems disconnected from society from time to time. without a listener, it can be pretty pointless. anyway, who says that you need to spend all your time making music to be a musician? you need time for ideas to ripen. of course, you're going to be in a dry spell if classes are suddenly over. all your energy was gathered for this, and now, you need a new target. don't rush it, one will come.
maybe it would have been good to finish the seemingly pointless program, just for the certificate....at any rate, it's hard to meet new people, even in an area with a big scene. people are often slow to warm to newcomers, especially within a scene. it takes time to discover the secret social conventions and passwords so that you can even get in the door.
even if you decide to move somewhere else, patience.....you have a lot of life ahead...
why not go visit the grand canyon?
-
kensuguro
- Posts: 4434
- Joined: Sun Jul 08, 2001 4:00 pm
- Location: BPM 60 to somewhere around 150
- Contact:
lol... actually, braincell, you weren't the only one to tell me not to go. A lot of people were wondering why on earth Florida.. including myself. Oh well, such is life, I'm trying to focus on the better parts of Miami, like the beaches and diving. Everything's an experience, and there's ways to build on it. Atleast I'd like to believe so.
I'll be working on connections around here though, haven't given up 100% just yet. Besides, I think this crisis has got me thinking about me and my music. And that's always a good thing. Right now, I feel like I've got a new set of shoes, and am trying to break it in. Strange feeling, but something feels "fresh" about me trying to fight my instincts as a musician.
The PlanetZ crowd is a special group, I've come to realize yet again. It's been a couple of years of exchanging ideas with the gang here, not limited to pulsar stuff, but extending into the deeper areas of musical aesthetics and artistic ideals... The stuff I read here still keeps me going, even if it's some of the only real inspiration I get at this time. Z is really a crowd of amazing people, I can't stress that strong enough.
I'll be working on connections around here though, haven't given up 100% just yet. Besides, I think this crisis has got me thinking about me and my music. And that's always a good thing. Right now, I feel like I've got a new set of shoes, and am trying to break it in. Strange feeling, but something feels "fresh" about me trying to fight my instincts as a musician.
The PlanetZ crowd is a special group, I've come to realize yet again. It's been a couple of years of exchanging ideas with the gang here, not limited to pulsar stuff, but extending into the deeper areas of musical aesthetics and artistic ideals... The stuff I read here still keeps me going, even if it's some of the only real inspiration I get at this time. Z is really a crowd of amazing people, I can't stress that strong enough.
-
Nestor
- Posts: 6683
- Joined: Tue Mar 27, 2001 4:00 pm
- Location: Fourth Dimension Paradise, Cloud Nine!
I’m sorry you are going thought this Ken, you deserve a good environment as you are serious about music.
Answering to your conversation with us, I have to agree that people is very important for musicians. For some reason, everybody wants from day one to be heard on what they do. So you start making efforts so as many people as possible can get in touch with your music.
This happens because we all need to be accepted as human beings, and whatever skill you may have, becomes better when it is recognized by others, because you are being valued. To be and feel valued by others (society) is as natural as drinking water or breathing some air.
Behind this important point, there is another one, “sharing” your vibrations with people. There is much more that what we can see in life, and for sure a community of musical feelings and some deep shared emotions makes us closer to each other, and so we nurtured each other mutually.
You can see what happens when there is a group of passionate people listening to a live performance; musicians get hot and happy, because there are some guys listening at them with some attention.
I remember contrary to this, an interesting experience playing in Paris, when the Cello got very angry to the public because nobody seemed to pay attention to what he was doing. He had to start the song with a short melancholic solo and all we could hear was people’s voices, he then cried out “wow”, while pushing a hard tone glissando. People were quite surprised at his behaviour but started paying attention to this playing. We all got quite cold and the performance was rather bad.
Music IS a social thing, despite the fact you can enjoy it by yourself, playing just for the sake of it, but it is naturally meant to be shared. As you say in your conclusion Ken, “audience” is very important to the musician!
In the other hand, we should never fall into an excess of it, as this may also kill your real inspiration. Once Pat Metheny was asked about what he thought about peoples likes and dislikes, and he said: “I don’t mean to be disrespectful to people coming to my concerts, but I don’t really mind their likes or dislikes in regard to the kind of music I do. The day a musician starts paying attention to what people have to say, they get in big trouble, big trouble, as they lose they spontaneity. If they like my music, well, this is great, but it is not the most important for me”.
A thought connected to the rest of these matters: For me, composing is an act of translation of an experience you have had in life into music, it all depends on your capacity to put it into a composition or not. If you connect with the source within yourself that gives you this connection “experience-musical ideas”, you are there and music smoothly comes out, if you cannot connect with yourself, music is always bad quality, it doesn’t matter how many plug-ins you use, or how complex your song may be, because it has not a core root…
Answering to your conversation with us, I have to agree that people is very important for musicians. For some reason, everybody wants from day one to be heard on what they do. So you start making efforts so as many people as possible can get in touch with your music.
This happens because we all need to be accepted as human beings, and whatever skill you may have, becomes better when it is recognized by others, because you are being valued. To be and feel valued by others (society) is as natural as drinking water or breathing some air.
Behind this important point, there is another one, “sharing” your vibrations with people. There is much more that what we can see in life, and for sure a community of musical feelings and some deep shared emotions makes us closer to each other, and so we nurtured each other mutually.
You can see what happens when there is a group of passionate people listening to a live performance; musicians get hot and happy, because there are some guys listening at them with some attention.
I remember contrary to this, an interesting experience playing in Paris, when the Cello got very angry to the public because nobody seemed to pay attention to what he was doing. He had to start the song with a short melancholic solo and all we could hear was people’s voices, he then cried out “wow”, while pushing a hard tone glissando. People were quite surprised at his behaviour but started paying attention to this playing. We all got quite cold and the performance was rather bad.
Music IS a social thing, despite the fact you can enjoy it by yourself, playing just for the sake of it, but it is naturally meant to be shared. As you say in your conclusion Ken, “audience” is very important to the musician!
In the other hand, we should never fall into an excess of it, as this may also kill your real inspiration. Once Pat Metheny was asked about what he thought about peoples likes and dislikes, and he said: “I don’t mean to be disrespectful to people coming to my concerts, but I don’t really mind their likes or dislikes in regard to the kind of music I do. The day a musician starts paying attention to what people have to say, they get in big trouble, big trouble, as they lose they spontaneity. If they like my music, well, this is great, but it is not the most important for me”.
A thought connected to the rest of these matters: For me, composing is an act of translation of an experience you have had in life into music, it all depends on your capacity to put it into a composition or not. If you connect with the source within yourself that gives you this connection “experience-musical ideas”, you are there and music smoothly comes out, if you cannot connect with yourself, music is always bad quality, it doesn’t matter how many plug-ins you use, or how complex your song may be, because it has not a core root…
*MUSIC* The most Powerful Language in the world! *INDEED*
-
paulrmartin
- Posts: 2445
- Joined: Sun May 20, 2001 4:00 pm
- Location: Montreal, Canada
I see this problem according to nursing theories advanced by Virginia Henderson. She put forward a model of the 14 fundamental needs of a human being in order to survive. Within the last 5 can be found 4 reasons for which we need to associate with others:
10.Communicate with others in expressing emotions, needs, fears, or opinions.
12. Work in such a way that there is a sense of accomplishment.
13. Play or participate in various forms of recreation.
14.Learn, discover, or satisfy the curiosity that leads to normal development and health.
I greatly believe in the Henderson model.
10.Communicate with others in expressing emotions, needs, fears, or opinions.
12. Work in such a way that there is a sense of accomplishment.
13. Play or participate in various forms of recreation.
14.Learn, discover, or satisfy the curiosity that leads to normal development and health.
I greatly believe in the Henderson model.
Are we listening?..
-
Nestor
- Posts: 6683
- Joined: Tue Mar 27, 2001 4:00 pm
- Location: Fourth Dimension Paradise, Cloud Nine!
I'm not suprised, because as far as what is listed in your post, those are absolutely REAL needs for all of us. Just thinking of having these things in your life makes you feel happier.On 2005-09-21 10:07, paulrmartin wrote:
I see this problem according to nursing theories advanced by Virginia Henderson. She put forward a model of the 14 fundamental needs of a human being in order to survive. Within the last 5 can be found 4 reasons for which we need to associate with others:
10.Communicate with others in expressing emotions, needs, fears, or opinions.
12. Work in such a way that there is a sense of accomplishment.
13. Play or participate in various forms of recreation.
14.Learn, discover, or satisfy the curiosity that leads to normal development and health.
I greatly believe in the Henderson model.
-
paulrmartin
- Posts: 2445
- Joined: Sun May 20, 2001 4:00 pm
- Location: Montreal, Canada
No. The first needs are about the need to breathe, to eat, to rest, etc.
The need to associate is not a luxury. It has been proven(sadly in a laboratory) that a baby cannot survive without human contact(yes, it died). In the Henderson model there is also a spiritual need included. I'll leave that one because it would take us off topic.
The need to associate is not a luxury. It has been proven(sadly in a laboratory) that a baby cannot survive without human contact(yes, it died). In the Henderson model there is also a spiritual need included. I'll leave that one because it would take us off topic.
Are we listening?..
-
paulrmartin
- Posts: 2445
- Joined: Sun May 20, 2001 4:00 pm
- Location: Montreal, Canada
ok, ok, here's the full Henderson model:
# Physiological
1. Breath normally
2. Eat and drink adequately
3. Eliminate body wastes
4. Move and maintain desirable postures
5. Sleep and rest
6.Select suitable clothes - dress and undress
7. Maintain body temperature within normal range by adjusting clothing and modifying the environment.
8. Keep the body clean and well groomed and protect the integument.
9.Avoid dangers in the environment and avoid injuring others.
10.Communicate with others in expressing emotions, needs, fears, or opinions.
14.Learn, discover, or satisfy the curiosity that leads to normal development and health and use the available health facilities.
# Spiritual
11.Worship according to one’s faith.
# Sociological
12. Work in such a way that there is a sense of accomplishment.
13. Play or participate in various forms of recreation.
# Physiological
1. Breath normally
2. Eat and drink adequately
3. Eliminate body wastes
4. Move and maintain desirable postures
5. Sleep and rest
6.Select suitable clothes - dress and undress
7. Maintain body temperature within normal range by adjusting clothing and modifying the environment.
8. Keep the body clean and well groomed and protect the integument.
9.Avoid dangers in the environment and avoid injuring others.
10.Communicate with others in expressing emotions, needs, fears, or opinions.
14.Learn, discover, or satisfy the curiosity that leads to normal development and health and use the available health facilities.
# Spiritual
11.Worship according to one’s faith.
# Sociological
12. Work in such a way that there is a sense of accomplishment.
13. Play or participate in various forms of recreation.
Are we listening?..
-
BingoTheClowno
- Posts: 1722
- Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2003 4:00 pm
- Location: Chicago
- Contact:
-
BingoTheClowno
- Posts: 1722
- Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2003 4:00 pm
- Location: Chicago
- Contact: