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While I read Ganools thoughts about the Vorb, Vokator etc. some thoughts hit me too.
Why we are running after every new thing that appears on the market like a dog after a piece of meat ?
I guess we are all addict to technic or new technical developments, every month it is Christmas for us, a new device, instrument, plug or whatever.

But this has a bitter flavour.
Today you can buy x Vocoders,Samplers and Synths but what to hell the future will bring us?
Another Vocoder,Sampler,Synth?
I think the market is flooded by such devices and I wish some developers will combine their strength and bring out a completly new device in a new way of thinking.

What I mean is something like a device for every task, the Kontakt goes a little in that way, a sampler sure but also a big sample based modular synth. Maybe Kontakt gets a Vocoder unit soon ? No, because this will make the Vokator useless or?
Can you imagine a multi NI device with any synthesis methode, sample possibility, drum units and big sample banks? Reaktor4? CW´s modular?
But sometimes I like to eat bitter things, we can choose!

I bought the Absynth and I like it very much, I bought the Absy Sound Volume I, 50 Euros for 256 Sounds, next month I will pay 99 Euros for 512 Sounds called Absynth2,haha.

Yes I´am addicted.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: ChrisWerner on 2003-04-26 06:57 ]</font>

The danger of course is that while you are playing with your latest toy, you forget to use the old toys and end up messing about instead of being creative (been there, still there.
Then you have so many toys, you forget which one is best for a particular task or sound, and end up trying lots of things out and "losing the moment" at a crucial creative juices time.
I just feel sorry for your dog - I feed my pet so he doesn't have to chase after food


But I do agree with you Chris. It is the same with hi-fis, cameras, videos, dvds and so on. Progress and market forces. Clever marketing to make you feels as if you want, even need it. It'll never change. The only solution is not to buy and be content with what you already have, but then you feel that you're falling behind everyone else.
Catch 22 situation that'll never change!

Well, this kind of thing is natural. I worked in the music equipment retail business for a while, and it's an industry that relies upon techno-gear-lust in order to survive. I recall it being very funny to read the latest press releases about this 'new revolutionary equipment' which gave you about as much inspiration as a sample CD, while seeing people going crazy over these new toys without really digging to see the true nature of the devices - it was astonishing to see how convinced they were by marketing.

However, the fact is that hardware has got very boring - the hardware industry has paid the price for rehashing boring VA's, ROMplers without adding any real new innovation. As a consequence (and also perhaps because of other factors such as the reeling global economy), software is king in the marketplace right now - people just aren't buying much hardware at all. And in a way I can understand why - the best hardware which is worth having tends to be very expensive. For example, Kurz K2600, Eventide FX, etc.

Unfortunately, software has, IMHO, a long way to go. For me, the algorithms are just not there yet. Nothing available as VST can inspire me as much as a good analog or Pulsar synth. The samplers are usable (I use Kontakt) but I tend to run everything thru Pulsar filters.

But I think the avalanche of software plugins will, in the long term, lead to more advanced and developed algorithms. I'm not holding my breath however, I think CPU's will have to be at least 5 or 6 gHz before I could do what I wanted to entirely in a native environment. Reaktor may be great in theory (it's a wonderful tool for people to create machines which would never appear as commercial hardware or software in a million years) but it's clumsy and unweildy. Once you start opening more than one instance things get rather clunky. And stability depends upon how well-written the .ens you're using is.

Also, I think audio software companies really need to sort out their policy regarding copy protection. I find the Creamware system to be perfect - buy a plugin and you have it *immediately*, and the protection does not bother the user in any way. Compare for instance the upcoming Reaktor4's protection system - a challenge and response internet-based affair! I won't ever invest in software like that.

Personally, I'll soon be investing in more Creamware DSP (8 is just not enough ).


peace

Yes Neil, the danger you described escorted me the last two or three years, I didn´t saw the wood for the trees.
I was lost in parameters, devices and
capabilities.

Today I can see the forest and start to think before I touch any key. What I´ll do, what are the best tools to reach the aim?
It´s nice that we can choose/buy our "tools" from a big evergrowing market. You are the man who knows what you want, who else?
You have to sort out the pillars only.

dArKr3zIn, we have to look what happend in the last years. Today you are able to produce the whole work from an idea to a final CD in your living room. In the past you had to pay much money to achieve the same result in a studio.
This is a very good evolution because I think that many more people can produce their thoughts to music, more than ever before.
It seems that the whole hardware world changes to the virtual world. With SFP you have a virtual studio, instruments, a Moog. Lance gets unutilized , you draw the cabels with a mouse. I´am curious to see what will happen the next 10 years.





<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: ChrisWerner on 2003-04-26 06:36 ]</font>

Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't be making music today if it wasn't for computers. I was merely commenting on what's been happening in the last 2 years or so - software is HUGE now - 2 years ago the only coverage of plugins in Sound on Sound magazine was a short section in 'PC Notes' or something. Now they have 4-page reviews on them. Symptomatic of what's happening.

Unfortunately, I think the VST side of things is beset by problems. These kind of problems are extremely irritating for people who are coming into software from the hardware world. Some of the things I am talking about include VST host incompatibilities/instabilities, a myriad of different preset systems, no standard implementation of MIDI learn for controllers (Pulsar totally *rules* in this department), copy protection and, most of all, quality. To my ears - and I tried to convince myself for a long time that this was illogical because "digital must equal digital" - VST synths do not really sound as good as hardware/DSP ones. I include hardware VA's and Pulsar synths in this comparison. For me, most VST stuff lacks 'body and character' - in creative terms they lack inspirational character for me. This is not so with the Pro1 solo for example, the Prisma or even a simple Mod3 patch, or something like a Waldorf Q or Kurzweil K2600. It's not simply down to converters - the algorithms simply sound better even out of the digital outputs.

Things do change, however, and it's all about progression and development. The software world is very young. When I think back to ReBirth, Rubberduck etc, things have come a hell of a long way! And there are things that are quite simply better to do on a computer screen. Sample editing for example. And software gives the chance to explore new avenues. I love Absynth for this (in spite of its terrible plugin and preset implementation), and the more innovative Reaktor ensembles. Like you, I am very intrigued by what is going to happen. Personally, I hope the VST world doesn't just descend into ROMpler hell (just look at the recent flood of huge sample libraries played through plugin frontends even more dull than a JV2080).

peace


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: dArKr3zIn on 2003-04-26 07:04 ]</font>

I suffered from this buying-mania when I first got the Pulsar-II. I downloaded free devices then started looking at the commercial ones. I bought quite a few and was happy with each one.

Then I started to look at VSTi, and started buying them too. I liked to be able to do an easy "export audio".

Then I thought that "nothing in Pulsar sounds like Absynth", so I got that.

Then I decided I didn't like the STS samplers (after I bought the STS-3000), so I got Kontakt.

Lately I've bought more VSTi because I really enjoy making lots of short loops. In fact this is all I've done for a while - lots of nice loops, but no songs.

Hosts have been another distraction: AcidPro (which I love) and FL Studio, but then I want good looping MIDI record as well, so I try various demos of Orion, look at Muzys, Traktion etc to find one that is "just right".

Then I think back to how things used to be and what INCREDIBLE flexability and powers I now have compared with that time. The effects, routing, memory, sequencing, song storage, editing, and then huge range of synths ! It used to be that I'd have one or at most two synths - now I have dozens.

And yet still I feel that things are "not quite right". I'm looking for other devices and effects for tiny gaps in this line-up which for no good reason seem to need urgent filling.

It really is a bad addiction, and a huge distraction.

Perhaps it's like what you hear about writers. The most common complaint of writers is that "there's always a good reason NOT to write". Gear-collecting for musicians is like that - a distraction from what you know you should be doing and really want to be doing.

It's an odd phenomena.

The only way I'm slowing down is because of current lack of funds and by convincing myself not to spend now because something even better is just around the corner !

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: spirit on 2003-04-27 00:01 ]</font>

Sprit - w0w

I've been pondering something for a while now... without warez the software approach does not seem so attractive and cheap.

There, I said it. The thing about software, and Spirit, I'm sure you're painfully aware of this, is that the resale value is very variable. Having certain things in a box certainly helps, but how about all those plugins which were bought online? How do you sell those if you decide they're not what you wanted? Even if you could manage to convince someone to buy a serial number from you, the licensing agreements often make this technically illegal. Because of this (and painful copy protection issues), I must say that I don't like to invest too much in native software. These issues and the fact that I got burned by eMagic have really kicked my confidence in software in the nads. The problems I've come across have almost been comical... when I bought Reaktor 2.3, the constant CD-checks during Logic-bootup actually made my system much more unstable than just using the crack.

I still buy software, mainly Creamware-based stuff, but also certain good native stuff by independent authors who put more time into their algorithms than their copy protection. I like to support guys like Rene from RGCaudio, Anarchy sound software and the Massiva author (have you checked out EnergyXT? it's awesome! and so cheap!). These guys care about their software and their customers - too many software companies/authors forget that the only way to combat warez is by giving good customer support.

All I can say is, you have a responsibility to your wallet AND to your music to use warez for what they're intended - try before you waste your time and money.

Also, I must say you're right about too many tools destroying creativity - similar things were happening to me and I made a conscious decision to stop installing new plugins. One DSP modular is worth a million VSTs to me. Simple, really


peace

I agree with most of what's written above, though I would define 'new' as 'recently discovered' in my case.
It just has to sound very good or very strange and (...if I can afford) I want it. There's a significant influence on what I'm playing (as a non-educated keyboarder) if the synth or fx unit changes, like some kind of inspiration triggered by the sound itself.

But recently I found my personal limit:
there's that phantastic Hartmann synth, undoubtly one of the most innovatives pieces of equipment and of course: I want one
I found a deep review of the instrument accompagnied with some sound sample on CD.
Well, to make a long story short: those 'examples' were the most ridiculuous stuff I ever heard.
There's this beautiful instrument, well designed in both usability and sound processing, but all those bloody reviewers are able to get out of it is the sound of - tadaaa... the Wavestation (hi John...)
The Wavestation is great, a classic, but if one (like the tester) doesn't get beyond it more than ten years (?) later - what should innovation be good for ?
Do we already have all those 'innovative' sound sources and are just unable to use them ?
Made me think at least, just like the next one:
I've invested quite an amount in CW stuff and I did it with pleasure, I love my system.
The mentioned review explained the structure of the Neuron's synth engine and I thought 'wow, I already have this...'
Basically it's 2 Python synths interconnected with a Modular patch
Of course the Neuron is the most smart thing for sound tweaking and I really appreciate their concept, but soundwise the thing would certainly double much of my CW stuff.
So I decided not to overstress my wallet, though whenever I see a pic of the Neuron, it's totally tempting...

my 2 cents, Tom

Hi Tom,

Could you please tell me what magazine it is that covers this Neuron review?

Thanks,
Vincent

hi Visilia,

German Keys Mag, April 2003, hope you can read it

cheers, Tom

If not, just search thru the off-topic section. You will find an atleast funny translater somewhere among the posts

Well, I don't like that translator anymore, since it was calling me weak and powerless. I think I'll just read the article in German. Ich spreche es very badly, aber being Dutch, ich verstehe most when reading it.

cheers!

vincent